Clippings by jenny1963

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RE: Does a reasonably quiet refrigerator exist? (Follow-Up #38)

posted by: budmen on 03.17.2010 at 12:53 pm in Appliances Forum

Some KitchenAid models come with an optional sound reduction package, so be sure to check that out. Even still, I'd take some steps to sound absorb, since it's rather simple and very low cost, especially if you are already going to do some remodeling work.

I plan on doing more a little. My fridge is in a corner, so when I get around to cutting out the drywall and inserting the wool, I'll do it not only on the back wall, but also on the side wall for extra sound absorption.

I also plan on cutting out a few inches of the back part of the tile floor where the back fridge rollers sit and replacing it with a firm rubber mat or similar material of equal thickness (I want the tile and rubber to be at the same height). That way the back rollers will sit on the rubber and absorb vibrations from the compressor when it kicks into high gear. This is another little detail manufacturers ignore, using cheap hard plastic rollers which have no vibration absorption.

Sine I'm remodeling the entire kitchen, I also plan on placing a cabinet on top of the fridge, therefore I should be able to place a sheet of wool under the cabinet (which if done right will be completely hidden from view) to absorb what sound comes up from the fridge.

The remaining exposed side from the counter up to the cabinets will be closed up with a panel. For the panel side, there won't be much of a gap between the fridge and panel (need to allow air flow), so I plan on lining the panel with a thin sheet of felt or similar material to absorb at least some of the sound.

Note you should NOT place anything on the fridge wall directly, since the walls need to conduct heat out, this is why you need to leave a gap which is usually .5" to 1" for air flow.

My other option was to sound proof the fridge itself, but to do that I'd have to modify the fridge compartment where the compressor sits, and that likely would void the warranty. I'd also have to insert a fan in the modified enclosure to cool the compressor by blowing out hot air (the F&P uses a passive heat exchange system, which means the enclosure is not actually enclosed, but full of air vents which allow sound to leak out), or I could install a passive heat sink around the compressor that extends out side of the enclosure - but this is way too complicated for me!


clipped on: 03.19.2011 at 08:07 pm    last updated on: 03.19.2011 at 08:10 pm

RE: Am I going to regret not boxing in my refrige with a panel? (Follow-Up #23)

posted by: rococogurl on 03.03.2011 at 09:03 am in Kitchens Forum

I had a non boxed in fridge and when we replaced it I boxed in a 30" freestanding Liebherr. Much better finished look. I don't agree at all about "done, done." I feel that happens when there's cabinet overkill.

Here is a link that might be useful: Fridge


clipped on: 03.03.2011 at 12:23 pm    last updated on: 03.03.2011 at 12:23 pm

RE: Are your uppers lower than 18'? (Follow-Up #17)

posted by: lolauren on 02.28.2011 at 03:27 pm in Kitchens Forum

My kitchen uppers are just under 17" above the counter, not including the trim. To the trim it's 15.25 - 15.5. I never requested anything but standard. I'm not sure if the cabinet installers put them lower than standard or if the cabinet company designed it that way. *shrug* I didn't even realize it until I measured that might tell you how much it has mattered to me or bothered me? :)

My coffee pot is the only appliance I need clearance for under a cabinet, and it fits fine. My mixer is stored and used at the island. The island offers lots of work space without cabinets in the way. Things to consider:

* Make sure your appliances fit
* If you have deeper than standard uppers, you might want them higher up. Since mine are normal depth (12"?,) they don't feel "in my face"
* Do you have other space to work, without uppers, like an island?

At 5'5, I can reach the first three shelves of my uppers. (I have stacked cabinets, so I essentially can reach everything in the bottom cabinet, which is standard height. The third shelf would require a step stool for anything pushed to the back.) my laundry room, the counter is at 41" (because it's over my w/d.) The cabinets are 19" above that. Thus, they are very high compared to normal uppers. We made this decision because the uppers are primarily for storage and we wanted a lot of usable counter space. I knew I only needed to reach the bottom shelf. As it turns out, I can reach the bottom shelf easily for all my often-used cleaning supplies. I can (barely) reach the second shelf's items (which is 12.5" above the bottom one.) I would never do this set up in a kitchen, but it works for a more storage-oriented upper.


clipped on: 02.28.2011 at 08:11 pm    last updated on: 02.28.2011 at 08:22 pm

RE: Question re Shower Mixers and Water Volume (Follow-Up #4)

posted by: david_cary on 02.22.2010 at 11:16 am in Plumbing Forum

My understanding is that pressure balanced tend to reduce flow. I did a 3/4 inch thermostatic and it flows like 17 gpm so it will not reduce flow. I would think that they make pressure balanced that will flow higher - it is just a matter of checking specs. And going with 3/4 inch even though you don't really need that much flow.

All is certainly not hopeless and you don't have to stick with 2 controls to have pressure - that is patently ridiculous.


clipped on: 02.28.2011 at 12:39 pm    last updated on: 02.28.2011 at 12:39 pm

RE: Do I really need a steam shower? (Follow-Up #10)

posted by: mongoct on 11.16.2010 at 03:02 pm in Bathrooms Forum

If your GC said you need a steam shower, then it must be so. After all he spoke. And you heard. When the truth has been spoken there can be no doubt. Only action.

So tell your GC that if you must have a steam shower, then it'll be at his expense. After all, it must be so. It is the truth. And he knows it. Because he spoke it.

Time for another gin and tonic.

Now seriously...

If for whatever reason you think you might want a steam shower later, but not now:

1) It's very common to hide the steam generator under the adjacent tub platform. Is yours located where that could happen? Sometimes they are put in an adjacent closet. Or down below int eh basement. Or up above in the attic. There are restrictions with the installation location, but as long as things are considered now the unit can be installed later.

2) You'll need a water supply to the steam generator. Easy.

3) You'll need electrical to the steam generator. Easy.

4) You'll need a vapor barrier on all six sides of the shower room cube. I usually use Kerdi membrane in steam showers. In steam showers I prefer the membrane to be right behind the tile (a topical membrane) to better control moisture within the shower. So if you can use Kerdi, or another roll-on topical membrane that is a VAPOR barrier (While topical roll on membranes are water barriers, not all are vapor barriers too) then that'll help.

5) The door. With steam you usually want a tightly fitting or a gasketed door. Can future-proofing for that add on be accommodated with your existing design?

6) Ventilation. You don't want a typical fan vent in a steam shower. Steam will be driven up into the fan housing and further along into the duct. It'll condense in the duct and run back down into the fan housing. The steam and condensate can ruin the fan, plus the condensate can drip into the shower. Drip. Drip.

I'll usually put the vent just outside the shower opening. Or use a positive dampered fan grill inside the shower that can be sealed when the steam function is on.

108) Ceiling. Code usually requires the ceiling to be sloped a minimum of 2" per foot.

Conslusion...with a bit of future-proofing today you can prepare the shower to be a steam shower tomorrow.

Or you can do it all now.

Or chastise your GC if he's giving you add-ons that don't appeal to your lifestyle or your budget.

Best to all...


clipped on: 02.26.2011 at 02:35 pm    last updated on: 02.26.2011 at 02:36 pm

RE: Questions about frameless cabinets (Follow-Up #13)

posted by: lascatx on 02.10.2011 at 11:28 am in Kitchens Forum

My frameless are a mix of Brookhaven and Woodmode. I never expected to have Woodmode, especially since I associated them with heavily detailed, framed and more ornate styles. You can get that, but they put the same quality into the framless cabinets and the main difference in the Brookhaven (other than price) will be on the interior -- drawer sides are lower (about half) unless ordered with full sides, laminated interior rather than finished wood. The cabinets are very solid -- both lines. But I really don't recall any actual experiences with frameless cabinets not being sturdy -- just cabinet folks trying to talk people out of them because they didn't sell or make them.

Something you might consider for appliances if you have an appropriate space -- a 13-15" deep base will hold most appliances and make them easier to get in and out than a deeper cabinet. My island size was limited by the previous one, so I used 21" deep vanity cabinets and 13" door cabinets (like a wall cabinet, but on a toe kick) installed back to back. The shelves are great for having everything right where you can see it and reach it -- no moving things in and out to get behind them or things getting forgotten in the back. The frameless cabinet just adds to everything being right there in the open.


clipped on: 02.22.2011 at 11:56 am    last updated on: 02.22.2011 at 11:56 am

RE: Questions about frameless cabinets (Follow-Up #8)

posted by: buehl on 02.10.2011 at 09:14 am in Kitchens Forum

Canishel...remember that Florantha is talking about roll out tray shelves (ROTS), not pullouts attached to doors or drawers. Neither drawers nor pullouts have hinges.

For all styles of cabinets, you will always lose a little space with drawers and pullouts b/c of the need for the drawer or pullout "box" to clear the cabinet sides and, in the case of drawers, for drawer glides (bottom or side mount). However, you gain far more in accessibility of the contents than you lose space.

Yes, frameless will require more filler than framed, especially more than partial overlay or inset cabinets. But, as you saw in Cheri127's pic, there are creative ways to minimize lost space.

Note that there are also "filler pullouts" that can be installed b/w cabinets and b/w walls & cabinets. Since they're attached to the adjacent cabinets or wall, there's no space lost due to cabinet walls.

For base cabinets, filler pullouts are available in 3", 6", and 9" widths. For upper cabinets, they're available in 3" and 6" widths in 36", 39", and 42" heights. For tall/pantry cabinets, they're available in 6" widths and 39" and 45" heights.

In your case, I would suggest using filler pullouts instead of cabinets in any situation you can b/c you don't lose that cabinet wall space. (I.e., don't get a 6" or 9" cabinet, get a 6" or 9" filler pullout!)

One note...filler pullouts must be installed at cabinet install time. They cannot be retro-fitted. (Although, you might be able to retro-fit a 9"...depending on your hand and tool size).

Base Filler Pullouts: Available in 3", 6", and 9" widths.

Upper Cab Filler Pullouts: Available in 3" and 6" widths in 36", 39", and 42" heights

Tall/Pantry Filler Pullouts: Available in 6" widths and in 39" and 45" heights that can be used alone or in conjunction with others to meet your 84", 90", or 96" total height requirements

Here is a link that might be useful: Thread: Rev-A-Shelf Spice Racks for Fillers -- Have you seen these!!!!


clipped on: 02.22.2011 at 11:50 am    last updated on: 02.22.2011 at 11:51 am

How to make cabinets up to the ceiling look good - 10 ft ceiling

posted by: enright on 06.24.2009 at 03:00 pm in Kitchens Forum

I really like kitchens with white cabinets with crown molding that goes up to the ceiling (ie Christopher Peacock style). But I cannot afford custom cabinets-- I've priced it. I want to know how to stack cabinets so that it will not look ridiculous. Should I put a 12 inch cabinet on top of a 42 inch cabinet?? A kitchen designer (who I did not like) told me that upper cabinets that are taller than 54 inches look bad. Is this true? I am not sure how to make a crown molding to close the huge gap between the top of 54 inch cabinets and the ceiling, which is at least 14 inches taller. Any suggestions or pictures would be helpful. I have looked at the finished kitchens blog but most of the cabinets are custom made or do not go to a ceiling as tall as mine.


clipped on: 02.22.2011 at 11:03 am    last updated on: 02.22.2011 at 11:03 am

Eye-Vac info and photo

posted by: kiffgirl on 02.21.2011 at 08:17 am in Kitchens Forum

I thought I would post separately about the Eye-Vac we used in the kitchen. It is a portable, stand alone vacuum you sweep to - kind of like and electric dustpan.

We had an extra outlet installed and then had the cabinet people cut out the bottom of the sink cabinet and toe kick. It works like a charm. It can be set to manual, where you turn it on once you sweep to it or left on auto, which is how we have it (with a sensor to activate suction). It is bagless, the front panel pops out for easy emptying. It has a filter, too.




clipped on: 02.21.2011 at 04:02 pm    last updated on: 02.21.2011 at 04:03 pm

RE: 30 vs 36 range - Better Look? (Follow-Up #1)

posted by: beekeeperswife on 01.28.2011 at 09:53 am in Kitchens Forum

We went from a 30" range to a 36" range. This includes buying a 30" DCS off of CL to use in the renovation (and then selling it again when I had a change of heart). I felt if we were to ever want the larger range, this was the time to do it, not in a few years.

I don't think the 36" range looks all that much bigger than a 30" range, but you are right, it does give it just a little more oomph, being wider.

I might not have all 6 burners going at once, but to be able to use all of my larger stock pots, and saute pans that never really seemed to work together on the 30" range makes the larger stove worth it. I do have all 6 going sometimes, though. And in my opinion, you do seem to have the room for a larger range (our kitchen is only 12' wide). Once you have a larger range, you will not want to go back. In fact, I'm dreaming of a 48" range so that I can get two reno.

Here's my range, you can see it doesn't look that big, and my room is only 12' wide.



clipped on: 02.16.2011 at 11:31 am    last updated on: 02.16.2011 at 11:31 am

Finished (almost) White Kitchen- PHEW!

posted by: dotcomgone on 01.19.2010 at 04:48 pm in Kitchens Forum

Thanks to everyone on Gardenweb for their wealth of information. While I haven't posted often, I have utilized this site daily to find information and inspiration. Thank you for taking your time to share your kitchen ideas so that others can benefit from your experiences.

We are almost done. Just a kitchen table, island stools, desk area chair and accessories to go. Our project started in June and was substantially complete a few days before Christmas.

Unfortunately, I don't have before photos handy and used my iphone to snap these shots. Sorry for the quality. Our old kitchen was L shaped as well, a galley style with eating area. We had white 80's cabinets (solid door) with soffits. Counters were white square tile. Our worst feature was the powder room in the kitchen space and window that faced into our neighbors house (current range wall.) We expanded our kitchen by pushing out the range wall. Other than that we had to work within the space. Our main goals were moving the powder room out of the kitchen, storage, fitting in an island and eating area and respecting the age of our home (1906).

I am happy to share any details if anyone is interested.

Thanks again to all esp. those who helped me through a mini-marble crisis.










href="" target="_blank">Photobucket

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clipped on: 02.16.2011 at 10:06 am    last updated on: 02.16.2011 at 10:07 am

RE: Kitchen window to counter height? (Follow-Up #7)

posted by: shanghaimom on 05.08.2010 at 03:15 pm in Kitchens Forum

Having the large new window right behind the sink is one of my favorite features of my kitchen. We could not do a bumpout (there is a narrow walkway on the outside) but I did trim the base of the window *almost* like the other windows. (The sill is a bit shallower and we skipped the deeper trim which should have been below.) We did have to bump the sink cabinet out a bit to allow space for big sink+ big faucet+ low window. Hope this photo is helpful:


clipped on: 02.15.2011 at 07:58 pm    last updated on: 02.15.2011 at 07:58 pm

RE: Kitchen window to counter height? (Follow-Up #6)

posted by: buehl on 05.08.2010 at 02:14 pm in Kitchens Forum

Some people like them, some don't. It's one of those things that are personal preference.

I will say, though, that if you do bring your windows down to the counter, try to bump it out a few inches to cut down on window splashing. I'm not sure how many people have this problem, but it is a potential issue. Our window is a bay window, so the window is approx 22" away from the faucet...we have no splashing issues.

Here are some threads with pictures, discussions, and installation instructions:

Thread: Counter Height Window Installation

Thread: counter height window pictures please

Thread: Counter height window owners--Help!

Installation Instructions:

Thread: Counter window hight -- please help!


clipped on: 02.15.2011 at 07:54 pm    last updated on: 02.15.2011 at 07:55 pm

Barrelhaus' little gem is done.

posted by: celticmoon on 10.17.2007 at 03:47 pm in Kitchens Forum

Duh. I posted this over on the main street side, and am just figuring out the way to the FKB is through the Gallery here. I am proxy posting for SIL Barrelhaus.

This was a challenging 11 x 12'6" space with a long wish list and a bunch o problems: rusting off center sink, dysfunctional windows, too small eating booth, no counter at range, teetering 20 year old appliances, and bad storage, e.g. pots and pans in the basement, baking supplies in the benches, trash in the hall closet, etc. Goals were to solve the problems and make it "fit" the charming older home.

Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket

Timelines: Years of yearning, then full tilt planning peaked in April with much help from this board. Demo started 3rd week of June and kitchen was completed by mid August. Including a week lost when opening the ceiling revealed that the upstairs bath plumbing needed to be replaced. It's always something.

Cabinets - Custom by local craftsman: Painted Maple & Stained Cherry

Paint - Trim and Cabinets-Benjamin Moore Winter Wheat 232
Walls(Bead Board)-B.M. Cream Fleece 233
Cabinents were glazed and varnished also
Stain- custom made

Countertop- soapstone-Mariana/Original

Light Fixtures- under cabinet lighting-Xenon
Sink fixture-Visual Comfort-chart house
Ceiling fixture-Hudson Valley Lighting

Sink- Fireclay Apron Sink-Shaw-Biscuit

Faucet- Hans Grohe-Tango Brushed Nickel

Dishwasher- Bosch (Integrated)

Range- Jenn-Air Stainless Pro

Refrigerator/Freezer -Sub-zero 700

Windows- Pella

Rug- Pottery Barn-Franklin Rug

Wall Mounted speakers- Monitor Audio

Hardware- Top Knobs, finish black patene

We both thank you all so much for helping!

Here is a link that might be useful: kitchen pix: before, plans, after, and details


small unfitted kitchen
clipped on: 02.15.2011 at 07:40 pm    last updated on: 02.15.2011 at 07:41 pm

RE: Revised: How many inches of granite for overhang on island (Follow-Up #3)

posted by: owls4me on 02.02.2011 at 10:04 am in Kitchens Forum

My island has a 12 inch overhang. It's fine for breakfast or hanging out but we use the table for a regular meal. The tallest family member is 5'6". If you want a little extra room you might try what I did on the island ends. It makes a huge difference with the prep sink.

The kitchen is functional but not finished in this pic. The other end has a panel. This end gets a dish towel bar.



curve keeps water from getting on floor
clipped on: 02.15.2011 at 05:30 pm    last updated on: 02.15.2011 at 05:31 pm

RE: If you have counter-height windows, I need help asap (Follow-Up #3)

posted by: histokitch on 02.01.2011 at 07:28 am in Kitchens Forum


Mine are double hung. There are 3, but only two show up in the picture. I also made the counters 30" deep on that wall, and have electrical outlets in the counter to meet code (that's the stainless steel plate on the counter).


clipped on: 02.15.2011 at 05:20 pm    last updated on: 02.15.2011 at 05:20 pm

RE: 30 inch counter depth/base cabinets - advantages/disadvantage (Follow-Up #10)

posted by: flatcoat2004 on 08.03.2009 at 06:29 pm in Kitchens Forum

My kitchen is 11'x14', and I chose to have one long counter along the 14' wall (containing the sink and range) that was 30" deep. I just used regular base cabinets, but had them bumped out from the wall a little. My priority was to have more work surface rather than more storage. I like the 30" counter depth a lot; even though I keep my counters clear of appliances and clutter, I do like to keep a few potted plants/herbs at the back of the counter under the lights.

I would think more carefully about 30" deep counters if you are short. I am 5'7", and reaching the back of the deep counters is a bit of a stretch. My 5' tall friend can't reach well at all.

Additional benefit - harder for the dog to countersurf if things are kept at the back of the counter :-)

I put 15" deep upper cabinets along the whole run. I love them. I can easily store my large dinner plates in them, along with good-sized appliances like the 12-cup food processor. And bottles of wine. Very important to have the wine accessible at all times.


Deeper countertops (also do 15" inch upper cabs!)

Actually like the backsplash

clipped on: 01.29.2011 at 08:32 pm    last updated on: 01.29.2011 at 08:33 pm

RE: Miele and SZ any experiences? (Follow-Up #15)

posted by: marcydc on 01.02.2011 at 09:50 pm in Appliances Forum

I have the 36" Miele top fridge (right hinge) and bottom freezer. I chose it over the subzero because of the more normal sized doors racks. We don't do gallons of milk, just 1/2 gal cartons of soy milk, so I wanted that space for condiments and the many sauce bottles I seem to accumulate.

We've had it for 3 months now. The panels are truly integrated and look just like the cabs (frameless) around them with the same 1/16" inch gaps. I like that it has the compressor on the bottom (tall people like this fridge) and nothing is visible from the front. SZ's may have a grill thing on top.

The shelving, particularly in the freezer drawer, seemed better quality to me that SZ. The freezer drawer is metal mostly, less plastic.

Had a subzero in a previous kitchen put in about year 2000. It's compressor went out about 2 months after its 5 year warranty was up- about $300 I think.

(Toe kick not yet installed on this photo)


Miele integrated with pantry
clipped on: 01.29.2011 at 07:29 pm    last updated on: 01.29.2011 at 07:30 pm

RE: Need help putting this tiny kitchen reno together (pics) (Follow-Up #25)

posted by: kmcg85 on 02.21.2008 at 09:14 pm in Home Decorating Forum

Antique White with SW Believable Buff walls.


Proportions of the room are uncomfortable, but how to use the space better?
clipped on: 01.25.2011 at 01:46 pm    last updated on: 01.25.2011 at 01:47 pm

RE: Seeking images of modest or quirky kitchens... (Follow-Up #6)

posted by: pickle2 on 03.04.2010 at 06:51 pm in Kitchens Forum

Loved the J&J kitchen! I was just so wowed by it, and stared at it a long, long time. I think what makes it work is their commitment to color and pattern (and of course their tremendous eye for combining said colors and patterns). I wonder if you layer color upon color and pattern upon pattern, the entirety of the picture becomes less vivid than if each color and pattern was presented on its own. Does that make sense to anyone else? Like if the Cooking Apple Green cabinets were solo in an otherwise neutral space, they would absolutely scream. That paint sample is up on my kitchen cabinet, and it is not a shy color. But in combination with the wallpaper and the tile, it all just becomes a harmonious whole.

I found this kitchen in a recent Farrow & Ball image hunt. I'm sure it breaks lots of rules, but love its warmth.

Image and video hosting by TinyPic

I've posted this kitchen before. It's not a quirky layout, but the backsplash are seconds purchased over two years so there was attention paid to both design and budget. It's a kitchen that looks like it's used well.

Image and video hosting by TinyPic


Quirky kitchens
clipped on: 01.15.2011 at 06:28 pm    last updated on: 01.15.2011 at 06:37 pm

RE: What was your best bathroom remodeling decision? (Follow-Up #105)

posted by: monsoon99 on 09.08.2008 at 05:34 pm in Bathrooms Forum

I am working on my remodel but one thing I did not read above and will add when I do my bathroom is add a niche in the wall next to toilet about a foot and half off of the floor and the size of a standard magazine with a bar running across the middle for magazine storage. Hate them in a rack on the floor near toilet.


Bathroom hint
clipped on: 01.15.2011 at 06:00 pm    last updated on: 01.15.2011 at 06:00 pm

RE: Kitchen layout - too tight? (Follow-Up #39)

posted by: buehl on 01.04.2011 at 12:11 am in Kitchens Forum

Taggie's plan is interesting, but keep in mind that it does not include any overhang for island's just a set of cabinets with 1.5" overhang all around with stools placed next to it. That will not be comfortable seating! Add in the overhang (15" is highly recommended) and then see how much room you have around the island.

One thing...if the path b/w the range & island isn't used much except for prepping & cooking (i.e., no through-traffic), it could be narrowed down to 39" or so. That would help with the aisle on the other side (b/w the wall & island).

Also, be sure you have at least a 36" aisle behind the seat on the "bottom" of the island.

Check to be sure Taggie has the doors in the correct places...the basement doorway in your plan "ends" approx 11' from the left wall while Taggie's ends at approx 10'6" if you "count boxes & partial boxes") That may be OK, but I just wanted you to check.

A note about a 36" wide table...only small children can sit at a 36" deep table if you have people on both sides...I know b/c that's what we had in our old kitchen (b/c that's the only size that would fit in our kitchen). You need at least 39", 42" is even better (that's what we have now and while there's still the occasional "his leg is touching my leg" or "she's kicking me" from the now-teens, it's generally OK.) Oh, it's not just leg room underneath, it's also room on the table for serving dishes.

As to width, people need at least 24" of linear 48" wide will only fit 2 people side-by-side, with no one on the ends. To have someone on the ends, you need at least another 12" on each end. So, a 6' wide table can comfortably seat 6 people...2 on each long side and 1 on each end:

12" + 24" + 24" + 12" = 72"

(Some designers are now starting to say you need 30" of linear space per person, but I haven't noticed that.)

I can't tell for certain what's to the right of the range and 18" cabinet...are they pantry cabinets? If so, I would consider making that 18" cabinet at least 24" for adequate workspace around the range.

About the corner...IMO, blind corner cabinets are a poor use of space, even with pullout inserts. I know that some people here like them, but even my KD who makes more $$$ on these inserts vetoed one. She said she has had so many complaints from clients with them that she always strongly discourages them. The "hardware" of the inserts doesn't last and if anything falls off you have to crawl inside to retrieve the item b/f you can close it. Corner susans, OTOH, are now usually designed so the back & side walls follow the contour of the shelves so there's no room for anything to fall off and the "hardware" lasts forever (our lazy susan was 13 years old when we demo'd our old kitchen and it was the only thing that worked as smoothly and as well on that day as the day it was installed!) Additionally, things are easily accessed in a susan...everything is right up in front...just rotate and it's right in front of you!

As to Palimpsest's PR, I've seen those and while they're not ideal, they do work. Just make sure the alcove is wide enough to fit a person standing there...including their elbows. It's definitely an option to consider when space is at a premium.


clipped on: 01.04.2011 at 10:01 am    last updated on: 01.04.2011 at 10:01 am

RE: how small can we go on a desk (Follow-Up #2)

posted by: plllog on 12.30.2010 at 07:02 pm in Kitchens Forum

My own small message center is about 6" deep and 30" wide (exterior dimensions). It has a place to hang the phone, a phone jack, an electrical outlet, some hanging shelves for pads and pens, and an 8" deep drop down "desk" at about elbow height. The desk has a piano hinge and a magnet to hold it up. I would have put a magnetic perpetual calendar inside, on a door, but I found a really pretty one which was too big. I gave into temptation and decided to put it on the little piece of open wall I have over the light switches, by the door. The advantage is that one sees the messages immediately rather than having to look for them. I have post-its that kind of match to make it a little less cluttery looking. Sorry about the no pictures yet.


desk/message center
clipped on: 01.01.2011 at 11:39 am    last updated on: 01.01.2011 at 11:39 am

finished kitchen - from freakishly small to functional

posted by: laurainlincoln on 11.17.2010 at 12:03 pm in Kitchens Forum

Hi everyone - I have so enjoyed looking at all of the smart, gorgeous kitchens on this site AND have learned so much from folks on this site, I thought I would share my finished kitchen.

We live in a 1920's house that had a tiny kitchen and a poorly designed family room and garage that was added on at some point in the '70's. We lived in the house for about 6 yrs before working with an architect to improve the layout and move the kitchen (we also added a mater suite above and addressed the exterior of the addition so it blends more with the original home). The kitchen was so small, we simply added it on the our existing DR.

We moved the kitchen into the space that had been a 1970's family room and then added a family room to what used to be a (weirdly enormous) patio. Arches that mimic those in the front of the house connect the new part to the old. My overall approach was everything wood leans historical (gothic cabs, big moldings, chunky window trim, etc) and everything metal (faucets, hardware) leans modern. Anyway, THANK YOU for everyone's help and collective genius! laura

old kitchen

with a crazy layout!

new kitchen

C - kitchen view from new family room


love our chunky and curvy and functional(!) hood

D - another kitchen view, stone is Madre Perola quartzite

a shot of the kitchen and new family room


Here is our dining room now, the old kitchen went from the far wall to the left of the window.

H - expanded dining rm (kitchen used to be at far end of this rm.  It went from that far wall to left side of that window.. it was tiny!)

Again, thanks for everything!!


Cool gothic gitchen. Neat mix of styles peninsula vs island! GREAT smaller white kitchen with great glass upper cabs, pretty granite and Stages 45" sink
clipped on: 11.28.2010 at 10:24 pm    last updated on: 12.31.2010 at 07:05 pm

RE: Help deciding which built in refrigerator (Follow-Up #11)

posted by: dixiedarlin1 on 09.03.2010 at 09:25 am in Appliances Forum

Kitchenaid/Whirlpool has had the variable speed compressor for many years. See the link. Jennair built ins are now made by Whirlpool and are similar to the Kitchenaid. Whirlpool also builds Thermador and Dacor built ins. From a servicers perspective; they are good, popular & reliable units.

Here is a link that might be useful: VCC


KA fridges have variable speed compressor!
clipped on: 12.31.2010 at 12:50 pm    last updated on: 12.31.2010 at 12:51 pm

Sharb-inspired Pantry Done!

posted by: buehl on 11.04.2008 at 10:52 pm in Kitchens Forum

We finally finished our DIY Sharb-inspired pantry! (Sorry folks, no chandelier!)

Here are the pics....

Come visit my pantry...

Pantry Entrance...

The door opens...

Entering the pantry...

The left side...

The left side has 15" deep shelves and holds, top-to-bottom, cereals, snacks & drinks, gluten-free foods, cookbooks & appliance manuals, two bins--one for yams & one for white potatoes, and toaster oven & coffeemaker on the floor. (Small appliance shelf now holds cookbooks. Toaster Oven & coffee maker are now on the floor.)

Left Side, top

Left Side, middle

Left Side, bottom/floor

The right side...

The right side has 12" deep shelves and holds, top-to-bottom, paper towels, baking/cooking supplies (next 3 shelves), small appliances, more baking supplies. The floor has a stool & paper plates & plastic cups. My extra oven racks are leaning against the far right wall. Eventually, we will be mounting our broom & dustpan there. (Don't know where the extra oven racks will go.)

Right Side, top half

Right Side, bottom half


clipped on: 12.29.2010 at 07:28 pm    last updated on: 12.29.2010 at 07:28 pm

RE: Proposed kitchen layout (Follow-Up #2)

posted by: florantha on 11.24.2010 at 09:57 am in Kitchens Forum

Looks good to me so far. I would use the area either side of sink for veg prep zone--foods move logically from refrig to sink to chopping to range. Store knives to the left of sink.

If you put a pull-out breadboard/cutting board in the corner between range and sink--perhaps on right of range--you will have a wonderful stool-sitting or standing prep area. Reach to the right and here are your just-washed veggies and meats and such. Work them over on the cutting surface, then transfer them to the left all ready for the pan. I'm a retiree with a new kitchen who's doing a lot of cooking from scratch as well as processing of garden produce. We did a mirror image of this work pattern in our new kitchen and I am really glad of the convenience. Being able to really tuck your legs under your work surface improves the comfort and allows you to keep working and stay off your feet if you need to. Having a window there will help with the claustrophobia potential.

I would use the area right of the pantry for baking zone, with baking supplies in drawers underneath. If you want things to be really convenient, put another of those pull-out breadboards on this left side of the range as well. You can plunk stuff from pantry onto the board even when you've got mixer and processor and stuff all arranged on the counter there. And you have an offload surface for grocery bags if the pantry door opens on the right. And it allows you to launch baking pans into oven and out again to a suitable receiving surface.


Kitchen layout
clipped on: 12.22.2010 at 08:11 pm    last updated on: 12.22.2010 at 08:11 pm

RE: Do you regret your island? Did you leave enough/too much spa (Follow-Up #14)

posted by: pps7 on 11.14.2010 at 08:40 pm in Kitchens Forum

I love our island.


It measures 48" x 96". Our aisles are 48". I'm not sure it's clear in the picture, but there's a large farmtable in our dining room right next to the island so I feel we get the best of both worlds. Another plus of the layout is that other people can access the fridge and clean up sink without coming into the work zone. The island is the workhorse of the kitchen. All prep work is done on the island. It also functions as a landing zone for our microwave and toaster oven.


Nice layout
clipped on: 12.19.2010 at 01:06 pm    last updated on: 12.19.2010 at 01:06 pm

RE: Single Sink Size (Follow-Up #10)

posted by: plllog on 12.16.2010 at 05:06 pm in Kitchens Forum

Regarding the actual sink size, rather than the cabinet, I can tell you that 18" square or round is about the minimum that is comfortable for a kitchen sink. For most people 22" wide is much better. Anything bigger than that is whatever your usage demands, such as if you want to put your roaster or cookie sheets flat in the sink.

Regarding the corner drawers, they hold as much or more as lazy susans do, and are greater or equal to the Magic thing without having to crawl over it to rescue whatever falls off. Are you buying these or having them made. There's a way to get more storage out of them than the Blum plans show. Here's my bad sketch of how mine were made. They extend back to the wall, rather than just the length of the glides, so aren't full extension (that is, they extend the full length of the full extension rails but were made bigger than that in the back). The cabinetmaker was able to carve an area for the pins to attach into.


Re the range, if it's the look you want, rather than the oven in front of your knees, you can make the cabinetry of your rangetop and pot drawers into a focal point. You can clad it in stainless, for instance. Or paint it blue. Use a slab drawer front just for the pot drawers. Or use scrollwork to make it special. Add "feet" in the toekick. That sort of thing. You can have look and function!


Helpful info
clipped on: 12.18.2010 at 08:55 pm    last updated on: 12.18.2010 at 08:55 pm

RE: Rut Roh!!! (Follow-Up #5)

posted by: florantha on 12.17.2010 at 11:03 am in Kitchens Forum

It's more than just needing an accent color, it's needing color complexity. I like to think that there are basically 5 color weights to choose from, from 1 (lightest) to 5 (heaviest, darkest). This kitchen is like my new oak kitchen with white fixtures and appliances--floor, fixtures, ceiling, cupboards, etc.--it only ranges from 3 to 1 in variation. This means you get to choose between a near-monochrome of weight in which you mess with subtleties OR you make a deep tone counterpoint OR you add a third color and use it at least 5 times. If you choose the subtleties method, you need to work in varieties of the oak tone, varieties of the whites, or varieties of a light colored contrasting color such as gray. If you choose to add the dark tones that the room lacks, there are options: a dark complex patterned oriental rug, a deep tone of paint used as an accent such as in a wide stripe above and below cupboards, some wrought iron in the table legs and light fixtures, a wall covering with some pattern including dark tones, you get the idea. If you choose the strong color counterpoint, you need to consider adjacent rooms, gardens or views seen out the window, etc. so that the color isn't jarring. Green apple green? Turquoise? Cherry red? A maroonish chocolate? tomato red? a set of complimentary greens? I suggest avoiding greyed colors--ex: clear greens instead of muddied greens unless there is a spectrum of greens.


Color theory
clipped on: 12.17.2010 at 07:23 pm    last updated on: 12.17.2010 at 07:24 pm

RE: If you only had 60''.... (Follow-Up #15)

posted by: boxerpups on 12.15.2010 at 12:24 pm in Kitchens Forum


Can you post a simple floor plan?
Just a quick drawing with measurements? Add outlets,
windows, lighting... that way GW can jump into to
help you utilize every spec of storage to make a
really functional space.

Small kitchens are magical. They utilized every inch of
space while creating an graceful fluid place to cook.
Here are a few others who made these fantastic kitchens
that were small on space but huge beauty with function.
I love them all.

Small kitchen - Big success by Arbodomas

Finished Tiny NYC Galley Kitchen!! from Charlikin

Katie's tiny kitchen reno

and a few images.

French Fantasy

HB mag tiny kitchen

Extraordinary kitchens

Stephanie Stokes

Vintage Yellow

Small White kitchen


Toe Kick


small kitchens
clipped on: 12.15.2010 at 03:23 pm    last updated on: 12.15.2010 at 03:23 pm

RE: 24' wide refrigerator/freezers: Liebherr, Northland, any othe (Follow-Up #4)

posted by: davidro1 on 07.07.2010 at 10:45 am in Appliances Forum

I got the LG. It's quiet. I like the heat near the door gaskets.
In the kitchen forum someone posted an image of his LG inside cabinetry.
I got an extra door bin. The door held a lot before, and really holds a lot now.
These door bins are reversible. You can turn them around and reattach them.
One way you get a low divider wall in the front, better for taking things out more easily, great for the door bins higher up.
The other way you get a high divider wall, better in terms of psychology alone. Storing things without seeing too much of them. Also in terms of psychology, it makes you feel the things stored there are more likely to be held well in case anyone ever tried to make them fall. Never happens. Just a psychology. Nothing ever flops over and falls. And the door opens easily so nobody ever has to give it a yank. Also, with the handle being where it is, it makes people use a finger or two instead of yanking with their shoulder.
Little things like this make a difference.
The freezer has three drawers and an ice cube tray.
I fit large frozen pizzas in the freezer drawers.
Also, I could remove any one of the drawers if I wanted to have a bit more space temporarily. Never happens.
What was the best thing before buying it? The number of shelves and the options given to raise or lower them. Also, two separate veggie drawers. Two is best, because some organics rot when placed with certain others (there are two kinds, so two drawers keeps Type A from Type B)
The meat drawer is a good thing to have. I was surprised how much difference it made in the fridge's "smells" when meat and sausages have a separate container to hold them.

I also got a drawer fridge, btw. We now have too much fridge volume available, so we deliberately go hunting for large amounts of edible organics at farmers' markets.

I think the air movement in my LG is good. It's minimal. It's not "Passive cooling" but almost. Better for foods. Previously my old fridge moved air too much and this caused stuff to dry out, rot, get freezer burn, etc. This has never happened in my new fridge. Things keep a long time. Leafy greens are still leafy greens after a week, or two, or three. Cheese doesn't get a hard dry crust on it where the plastic wrap is opened. Soft fruit like peaches still look good after a long time; they don't shrink and shrivel up.

After researching this subject (refrigeration and the fridge business) for while, I'll say that I would trust Blomberg to have good product. From what I know of European, Asian and American fridge manufacturers. Each of the Blomberg models is quite different once you look at the mechanical systems and parts. The Summit CP171 is another good fridge, imho, based on what I've read. Passive cooling is better for foods. A Danish company (Vestfrost) makes 24" fridge-freezers that passive-cool and with two compressors on two independent circuits, all at a low price point. I saw both the "old' and the "new" Vestfrost in operation. Very good. We almost bought one. Rebranded under the name "Conserv". The cp171 is a Vestfrost or a copycat. Fagor is another 24" fridge. I heard the noises it makes, that are well described in the PDF. Apart from that, it seems like a good fridge.

In terms of interior volume, use a measuring tape if you want to compare different manufacturers' products. Do not rely on numbers given to you by the manufacturers. There is a huge range of (acceptable) methods used to calculate volume, in nominal terms, not in any way related to the real volume inside the fridge. A fridge with one shelf less than another fridge will give you a great deal less space. So the number of shelves is more important than the apparent volume.

In each of the topics covered above, the LG is the best. Alone or equal to others also at that level "Best". The PDF explained what I wanted to know. I found it on their web site. That clinched the deal for me. It even told me the fridge exterior would be warm near the door (among other places). Sounds like a good idea, to tell the customer where the heat goes when it gets transferred from inside the fridge to the outside. When a fridge has its heat coils all on the back wall and only there, it needs air circulation behind it, and you are forcing the system to work extra hard if you back it up close to the wall. So, to have some of the heat being evacuated all around the sides Makes Perfect Sense to me.



Fridge notes. LG
clipped on: 12.07.2010 at 08:04 pm    last updated on: 12.07.2010 at 08:05 pm

RE: replace MW & toaster oven with advantium or speed oven? (Follow-Up #13)

posted by: plllog on 07.11.2010 at 05:37 pm in Appliances Forum

And therein lies the difference: We want a good, crunchy, caramelized top on toast, i.e., browning, and that's what I didn't like in toasting in the Advantium. So I guess it comes down to how you like your toast to come out. I actually have room to keep my $25 toaster oven on the counter, but it's so light it's easier to plug it in in the eating area, and to pick it up, empty the crumbs into the sink, and put it back in the drawer.

One thing to be aware of with the Advantium, since you'll be using it for so many things, is that you'll be swapping trays a lot. Since you're remodelling, it's vital to put storage for the accessories right handy to the Advantium. GE actually make a stainless drawer for the trays, that probably takes the least space, but I don't think it even holds the wire rack. I had a drawer installed between my Advantium and the warming drawer under it. That's big enough for all the trays, the rack, microwave dish covers, potholders and aprons. A tall narrow cabinet might work just as well. The important thing is not to think the bottom drawer, or across the kitchen or whatever, will be convenient enough. Everyone I know who did that hates it, and says she doesn't use the full capabilities of the Advantium because it's just too much trouble. The trays need their own space, where there's nothing blocking them, and where they're easy to put in and out on the fly. This could be a section of a larger tray cupboard, but you don't want them hard to get out, piled with other things, or anything like that. Since you're doing a stack, it might work to have them in a drawer under the main oven, but don't make it a single deep drawer. Do a shallow one for the Advantium stuff, and whatever under that.


Advantium hints on installl
clipped on: 12.05.2010 at 09:36 am    last updated on: 12.05.2010 at 09:38 am

RE: Layout Ideas - How's this one? (Follow-Up #6)

posted by: buehl on in our closet and I wish it were 6" to 12" wider). in Kitchens Forum

The DW...

  • The DW is in the path b/w the cooktop (range?) & sink.
  • The DW is right in the middle of the Prep Zone (which will be on the wall run to the right of the sink b/c it's across from the range, it's next to water, and it's not in the path to the pantry.)

    Remember, you spend far more time prepping (70%) and cooking (10%) than you do cleaning up (20%) if you must choose b/w the DW & Cleanup Zone in the path to the pantry or the Prep Zone, the Cleanup Zone makes a lot more sense (both b/c of time spent in the path as well as proximity to range)

  • The DW is also opening into a rather narrow aisle. When open, it will stick out into the aisle approx 30"...leaving 9" to get by...or less...see next point
  • Are your aisle measurements cabinet-to-cabinet or counter edge-to-counter edge?

    If the former, then the aisle b/w the island and sink wall is really only 36" b/c there's approx a 1.5" overhang (to cover the doors/drawer fronts plus a bit more to protect them from spills). Add to that the "extra" 2" or so depth of most ranges, and it's down to 34". The "hall" to the pantry will be approx 1.5" narrower as well.

  • The trash pullout is far from the Prep & Cooking Zones. You will find that you generate far more trash and recycling waste while prepping and cooking than you do while cleaning up...even if you don't have a garbage disposal. Additionally, you generate that trash/recycle wast for a longer period of time and multiple times during the day.

    Most people cleanup once or twice a day...but prepping, and to some extent cooking, usually goes on all day on & off.

    By far the biggest mistake I made in my kitchen was putting the trash pullout next to the cleanup sink in the Cleanup Zone. I have to cross an aisle approx 6' wide to get to the trash & recycle bins from my Prep & Cooking Zones...often dripping all the way.

  • Be aware that a 24" walkway is pretty narrow...I would try it out b/f you commit to that narrow an aisle in the pantry. And test it out w/full-height (like stacked boxes), not drawing it on the floor or using a single layer of short boxes - you need the "mass" to get the full effect (we have a 24" aisle
    in our closet and I wish it were 6" to 12" wider).

I understand you're the primary cook, but does that mean that no one else ever works in the kitchen or does other things in the kitchen at the same time?

Is the "third" person in your family a child or another adult? If child, do you plan to teach him/her to cook and cleanup? If so, you need to have room to teach and to allow him/her to work at the same time as you are.

Range in looks like you plan to have at least 24" on each side and behind it...very good! Do you plan to have an overhead rangehood? (Please say yes!) In this particular instance, I think I prefer the range in the island to the sink (yes, you heard me right!)

My recommendations:

  • I would switch the DW & Trash pullout, make that 27" cabinet 33" and move the sink, etc. down accordingly. If you just switched the DW & trash, the DW would then open in front of the "hall" leading into the pantry, that's why I'm suggesting making the 27" cabinet wider..

  • I suggest either a "low profile" rangehood or one that's oversized both in physical dimensions (at least 6" wider & 27" deep) and fan speed (at least 900cfms)...that way you can mount it higher than the recommended height so it won't be in your face while cooking.


layout ideas
clipped on: 12.04.2010 at 05:09 pm    last updated on: 12.04.2010 at 05:09 pm

Superwhite Quartzite Island and Pietra Counters Installed (pics)

posted by: sparklekitty on 06.26.2010 at 10:09 pm in Kitchens Forum

We just had the counters installed. I really appreciate when others post photos of their kitchens in progress. It has been very helpful to hear about the experiences and decision making process, so I will share mine. But first the photos (sorry they are dark - the island is not nearly as gray/dark in person.)

View of kitchen from dining room

Best photo I have of island (now covered with plywood as contractors continue work on the rest of the house) Photobucket

As you enter the kitchen from the foyer

I am one of the many who love marble but knew my DH didn't want and I didn't feel strongly enough to push it through (though I have done that on many other things :) so super white was recommended by a friend. After visiting several stone distributors & fabricators, my husband fell in love with an unusual slab of super white (or is it Supreme, they all called it something different) quartzite that had high contrast that I had not seen previously in super white. I love the gray softness of the Pietra against the red birch and as a backdrop for the super white so we had a plan.

I figured the SW slab was polished so the island would be. I took the path of least resistance, or so I thought. Of course the counters showed up & the island was honed. I tried to check it out in the truck but could not see much so convinced the installers to lug in the slab (86' x 41' !) and place it on the island (after much deliberation and annoyance that I had to re-make a decision I had made only because I was never really committed to the original decision.)

But surprise - white quartzite is a real treat honed. It softened the somewhat intense contrast and had the added bonus of random shiny pieces of quartz that don't really hone and didn't stand out when the stone was polished (not shiny like mica flecks but small chunks.) Honing actually highlighted the beauty of the stone in my opinion. Thankfully there was a previous GW post that mentioned this (that I found in my decision making frenzy) and motivated me to have them lug it out of the truck in the first place.

So I will post better photos when I have them, but thought those considering white quartzite might benefit from my photos & story.

So now I just have to choose my back splash (see link below) - I did choose my paint (BM Revere Pewter & window trim in BM White Dove to let the wood be the feature.) Any additional thoughts on BS would be appreciated (and no I am not going with the blue tile I was fooling around with in the link below - just too much I think :)

Here is a link that might be useful: Previous backsplash post


super white honed granite quartzite
clipped on: 12.01.2010 at 05:00 pm    last updated on: 12.01.2010 at 05:01 pm

RE: Granite Versus Marble (Follow-Up #9)

posted by: firsthouse_mp on 10.06.2010 at 09:00 pm in Kitchens Forum

My DH just couldn't imagine my nervousness at the etching problem with three kids and many parties....We went with the white quartzite. We used one slab,the largest and best slab of the ones they had, and in the end we even had reduce our cabinet by 3" to accommodate the max slab size. The island is 61" x 106" with a 2.25 square edge.

We have been so happy with our white quartzite--no etching and no staining!!! We had 40 people over for drinks and there was red wine, lemons, tomatoes, olives, food everywhere--no problems with clean up the next day. My 12 year old has been cooking a lot and she is a mess but I want to encourage the cooking, so have bit my tongue when things are spilling all over. Luckily I don't have to worry! :) We even did our backsplash in the quartzite...



Great looking white kitchen. Quartzite.
clipped on: 11.28.2010 at 11:11 pm    last updated on: 11.28.2010 at 11:11 pm

RE: Now that I have [X], I think I could have lived without it. (Follow-Up #105)

posted by: boxiebabe on 07.12.2008 at 02:54 pm in Kitchens Forum

Wow, I can't believe that I sat here and read this entire post. I couldn't pull myself away, so I have tons to contribute and ask.

Things I'd do without:
Plug Mold. I'd rather have 2 regular outlets in my backsplash. Regular outlets are easier to reach, and for the coffee maker that sits out on the counter, the plug is above it rather than behind it. I find myself constantly adjusting where the coffee maker is to HIDE the cord.

Convection: It's a setting on both my oven as well as my microwave. I never use it, because as one poster said ealier, I've had several failed attempts and it would have been easier and quicker to just have used conventional bake.

Pull-out Shelves on Lower Cabinets: If I had to do it all over again, I would not have pull out shelves and doors on the lower cabinets. I would have deep drawers all the way around.

Automatic Dishwasher Soap Dispenser: Worthless. Our GE Profile top of the line dishwasher wouldn't get the dishes clean no matter what setting we used. As per the advice of a kind GW'er, we tried using powdered soap. Wah-Lah!
Clean dishes. Now we're back to putting soap in everytime we're ready to do a load. We really liked not having to do that, but the automatic dispenser is just a dinosaur now with no action. A dinosaur I am sure we paid dearly for. On that note, I would have skipped going top of the line in the GE Profile series and got a regular dishwasher without all the bells and whistles.

Cork Flooring: We've had an install nightmare that I won't go into here - but suffice it to say, I think we're leaning toward going with engineered hardwood to replace our VERY expensive cork that was installed improperly.

End Panels on the bar side of the peninsula: Very expensive add-on that is pretty well covered up by 4 large barstools. We could've just adding some kind of trim molding later and saved quite a few bucks.

Tip Out tray under the sink: We had one in our old kitchen and we used it all the time. We *rarely* use the one in the new kitchen for some reason. Not quite sure why. But, it cost around $60, so that was a tiny bit of dinero I could've saved.

Glass cabinet doors: We have 3. Two that are on either side of our flat screen tv/wine rack deal are really pretty and I'd do that all over again. But the one that's next to the fridge - I'd just as soon have a regular door so that I could store less pretty stuff and more practical stuff.

Re: Trash Pull Out: I couldn't live without it. Although I don't have an official bag storage place built in... I do have 1 trash can, and 1 recycling can. I have increased my recycling by 100%, and I was an avid recycler before. So much so, that I had to call the garbage company and request a 2nd 100 gallon recycling cart. It's amazing how much you can recycle if it's convenient. One little "trick" I learned reading Martha Stewart or Heloise or someone like that: put your extra trash bags in the bottom of the trash can, then they're always handy when you need to replace it. I too get the Costco huge box of trash bags, and they go on the Super Susan next to the trash drawer. But I always keep about 15 bags in the bottom of each can and it's great! Replacing the 15 is just a cabinet away.

Pull-out cookie tray divider thingie: I have no idea what I paid for that gimmick/gadget, but I would skip it. There are many other places for my trays and better ways that would be more convenient. I rarely pull the deal out even though it's a pull-out, and I must have too many trays crammed in there because I always end up fighting to get the darned things out.

Cate: Get the new fridge. Match your appliances. Just my opinion. :)

WANT: Foot pedal for trash drawer. Yes, I am obsessed with my trash/recycling drawer. :) It makes me happy!
It's probably one of my Top 3 favorite things in our new kitchen.

There were more comments I wanted to make, but by the time I finished reading through all the posts, I have forgotten about them. Oh well.. as if this isn't long enough.

Happy Saturday, Y'all!


Great kitchen notes
clipped on: 11.27.2010 at 11:51 am    last updated on: 11.27.2010 at 11:52 am

RE: Now that I have [X], I think I could have lived without it. (Follow-Up #32)

posted by: rmlanza on 08.10.2007 at 12:27 pm in Kitchens Forum

I ordered the tilt outs for my sink and it was only like $20. I figure if I don't use it, it's not a big loss but I didn't want the suction cup basket thing I used to use for sponges or to have to go rooting around under the cabinet for the sink plug on the rare occasions that I actually use it. And if you're trying to save $1600, a sink tilt out isn't going to get you close. I'd go more for a trim style or end panels or something. We figured out that if we ordered the matching beadboard end panels for our island and the back of our bar from our cabinet company it would have cost us $1200. You can go buy unfinished 4'x8' sheets of beadboard for less than $20 and stain them yourself or even paint them a contrasting color. We are doing ours in a distressed black to match our entertainment console in our family room. And things like the crown molding, too. You can easily do that yourself for a LOT less than the cabinet makers charge. You may even be able to get your stain from them so you can match it perfectly.
Good luck!


Cabinet end panels
clipped on: 11.27.2010 at 11:45 am    last updated on: 11.27.2010 at 11:46 am

RE: Now that I have [X], I think I could have lived without it. (Follow-Up #36)

posted by: cate1337 on 08.10.2007 at 09:22 pm in Kitchens Forum

Hmmm. Rmlanza, you have a good point about the cabinet end panels. I'm still waiting to see cabinet costs broken down, but I suspect they added towards $1000 to the cost. We'll have a lot of them around the island. I plan to ask the KD if we can take a pantry door and flip it on its side to cover the exposed island side. I'm tempted to not panel where the bar will be, because there will be either bar stools or people's feet, but I can't quite decide. The bar will be raised on those little metal legs; and the island wall will be flush across; so I, at least, will notice. Plus, I do want to try for a furniture look for the island to help the transition to the living room.

I've nixed the glass door, idea, too. :( It just doesn't work with our set-up (3 cabinets on one side of the sink, 2 on the other). I'm trying to find other ways to bring glass into the space: the hood, the bar, drawer pulls, a pendant over the sink maybe.

Sounds like the Tapmaster and trash can foot pedals are worth the extra expense. Wonder how my in-laws would react if those were on my Christmas wish list this year? :))

Glad - This will be terrible. The existing white fridge will be right beside a new stainless oven. Yech. Que sera' sera' until next year (unless I find a way to haul the fridge to and from a body shop to have those fellows paint it). That's great that you'll be able to pass your fridge on to your neighbor. I asked the appliance store what they do with our appliances that they haul away - sounds like they go to a place like those places where stolen cars are stripped, then the remnants to appliance heaven.

Jkom - I meant to thank you specifically earlier for the tip on "what will fit in my space now." It would make me crazy if the fridge that I thought was best couldn't go in my new kitchen. I'll make sure to plan for that.

Fori - I agree that Consumer Reports sometimes does things oddly. I rely on them (and very heavily, but sometimes I wonder what in the world happened. The floors report, for example, in which they slammed almost every "environmentally responsible" floor.

Too many people responding here to address every one. I'm really enjoying that this thread is continuing and appreciate all the thoughts and advice.

OT - The contractor came by tonight to look at our kitchen again and to look at our KD's plans. I think we've found a great contractor. I know I'm saying this before the work has been done; but he returns phone calls, initiates phone calls, understands that I'm on a budget, and tries to figure out what's happening with our bizarrely-built house and figure out if it needs to be fixed. Essentially, we have foundation and roofing issues (whee); and I should be burying my head in the sand like an ostrich (well, more than I am); but I feel good enough with the contractor to not freak out (much). Course, there's a teeny little part of me that wants a lousy contractor who'll just do the kitchen and let us find out about everything else when it falls on our head in a couple of years... lol!


Cabinet end panels
clipped on: 11.27.2010 at 11:42 am    last updated on: 11.27.2010 at 11:42 am

RE: Sink directly opposite cooktop (Follow-Up #5)

posted by: elizpiz on 11.26.2010 at 05:15 am in Kitchens Forum

Ummm....with all due respect, IC - and you know I love your kitchen(ssss) - this is our set up and we love it. Works really well and we do a ton of cooking. Wouldn't work as the main and/or only sink, but I love the functionality of being able to prep and then turn around directly throw whatever (veggies, cut up meat etc etc etc) right into the pan.

We have absolutely no problem navigating with the two of us busily cooking. Might not be as practical with more ppl underfoot (ie cooking) - but then again our kitchen was specifically designed with two cooks in mind. And the island set up means the guests generally stay out of our way!

Aisle width is about 40"



Kitchen prep sink/stove layout
clipped on: 11.26.2010 at 05:54 pm    last updated on: 11.26.2010 at 05:55 pm

RE: What do you wish you had done differently? (Follow-Up #103)

posted by: rmlanza on 09.29.2007 at 06:39 pm in Kitchens Forum

I got lower only pullout trays in my 45", 3 drawer cabinet in my island. I wish I hadn't gotten those pullouts. There is a fixed shelf on top and each door has a small pullout. the pullouts are so narrow there isn't much that can fit in them except maybe my toaster...which I pretty much keep out all the time anyway. I suppose I could use them for dish towels and placemats but it drives me nuts that I've lost all that potential storage space and paid more for it to boot! I wonder if I can rip them out?! On the ends of the island I have full height angled cabinets (no drawers) and those are great. Even with the angled shelf I can fit my KA mixer and lots of tall pitchers on those shelves.


another kitchen pullout opinion.
clipped on: 11.26.2010 at 02:55 pm    last updated on: 11.26.2010 at 02:56 pm

RE: What do you wish you had done differently? (Follow-Up #102)

posted by: amsunshine on 09.29.2007 at 04:31 pm in Kitchens Forum

I love my pullouts!! In my own unique situation, I found that they gave me more flexibility than drawers in two of my base cabinets. I have two cabinets with two pullouts each and one shelf each -- three storage levels below the top drawer (so four altogether). The top pullout is for "flat storage", where I have placemats in one cabinet and dishtowels and microfiber cloths in the other. The next level down is a shelf which holds my heavier roasting pan(s) and the other holds my most used handled pots for quick grabbing. The bottom rollouts store my other pots and pans. If I had gotten drawers, I would lost the upper flat storage pullout, which I love having. But again, this works for my unique kitchen and the way I operate in it.


kitchen pullouts
clipped on: 11.26.2010 at 02:54 pm    last updated on: 11.26.2010 at 02:54 pm

RE: What do you wish you had done differently? (Follow-Up #62)

posted by: napagirl on 08.21.2007 at 03:07 am in Kitchens Forum

My dish/hand towels are going in a 6-8" wide open front base cabinet with a pull-out towel bar. I saw quite a few in mag photos and liked the look.


place for dishtowels
clipped on: 11.26.2010 at 02:22 pm    last updated on: 11.26.2010 at 02:22 pm

RE: What was your best bathroom remodeling decision? (Follow-Up #92)

posted by: brugloverz9 on 05.28.2008 at 01:31 am in Bathrooms Forum

emily...Thank you! I am so glad to be finished, I second guessed all of my decisions and am realy glad that I am happy with the way it turned out.

collage...My sink is Kohler, is 12 X 20 inches.
The divided drawer is

Image Hosting by


Drawer divider. Bathroom
clipped on: 11.26.2010 at 12:24 pm    last updated on: 11.26.2010 at 12:25 pm

RE: What was your best bathroom remodeling decision? (Follow-Up #44)

posted by: dmlove on 06.12.2007 at 01:34 pm in Bathrooms Forum

Bumping this up (because I never responded :)):

Best decisions:

1) Thermobalance valves on each shower head (two people shower concurrently most mornings and like different water temperature)

2) Kitchen-height cabinets (although I failed to take into account the height of the sink, so they're about an inch higher than would be ideal)

3) Toto toilets everywhere

4) Large drawers to store clean towels and wide shallow drawer to store daily use items. I keep them in two baskets which can be easily removed and replaced.

5) Adding a beautiful frameless shower door (had an open shower for 20 years before)

6) Shampoo shelf (we got the idea from a hotel shower)

Bad/less bad/unnecessary:

1) Seat in shower - used only as a place to prop up a leg.

2) Body sprays - used infrequently

3) Keeping the old full-wall mirror (still going to change it, but it has kept us from "finishing" for a almost a year now).

4) Should have done heated floors (even though this is California, tile floors are cold, period)

Worst decision:

Not putting the plug for the hairdryer inside the top drawer.

Mariainny, I don't know if this is what home_nw was referring to, but here's a picture of our shampoo shelf. We have no glass except for the angled door, so you can't see the shelf from elsewhere in the bathroom.

Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket


Shower shelf and seat
clipped on: 11.26.2010 at 11:24 am    last updated on: 11.26.2010 at 11:24 am

RE: What was your best bathroom remodeling decision? (Follow-Up #23)

posted by: arlinek on 03.05.2007 at 06:59 pm in Bathrooms Forum

My glad-I-did's:

Kept a hands-on daily watch over all work done, critiquing and making sure it was done as WE wanted (measuring and re-measuring and writing that measurement on the wall for each contractor so there was no dispute);

Taking progress photos every few days, as needed. Sometimes looking at pics on the monitor shows something that might have been overlooked - also good to have if there's a prob. later on with contr.

Making sure tile man interspersed nat'l tile in a pleasing manner and not bunching up a few "odd-colored" tiles together. This is SOOO important, friends - often overlooked by tiler as he's doing the work (but not Bill and Mongo, that's for sure!!).

Deciding to keep perfectly good jetted tub (though it's never used) for future sales' reasons.

Deciding to keep existing white-washed oak vanity (88" long, I think). We had it (and throughout the house) faux-finished to look like a fruitwood type of look and they're lovely! Would have cost us $15,000 at the least to replace all those cabs in the house, otherwise.

Spending prob. 15 hours at numerous tile stores trying to find another company's qtr. round to hopefully match the tile I loved and which didn't come with any trim - FOUND it!!! (But make sure to get current sample FIRST!!) You'd never know they're from 2 companies.

Having the shower niche made with a lower shelf towards bottom so there's an appropriate 3-1/2" high opening for the 2 bars of soap.

Moving an elect. outlet up a little bit near sink so it's out of the way of the listello across the wall.

Finally figuring out to use a little razor-holder with suction cup on the lower part of wall in shower to hook wash cloth onto, instead of stressing over where I'm going to keep wash cloth.

Stressing over how to design a custom-made medicine cab. in order to remove virtually everything off the vanity. Finally, after looking for ideas, found several brands of cabs that are 36" high, allowing for elec. toothbrush and mousse cans, etc. to fit, along with the usual stuff inside, including 2 interior mirrors ... a bonus.

Laying floor on the diagonal - love that look.

Spending the extra $$ for a frameless shower enclosure and using the newer swivel piece at the top of the door so less metal brackets are needed along the door and wall. Insisting (!!) on using the 1/2" high U-channel, which is lower profile, instead of routine 3/4" high that glass guy wanted to use. He hadn't used the 1/2" before (as well as the new door swivel bracket) and it was clearly approved by bath specs.

Getting the pressure-balanced faucet with temperature setting on it. It's great to just turn on and not have to fiddle with hot/cold knobs - our temp is "pre-set" but easy to override if we suddenly want colder or hotter.

WISH I'D DONE: Learn to relax a little and realize it's "just a bathroom " - HAH!!


Bathroom, spec shower door notes
clipped on: 11.26.2010 at 11:00 am    last updated on: 11.26.2010 at 11:00 am

RE: What was your best bathroom remodeling decision? (Follow-Up #4)

posted by: warsher on 02.19.2007 at 11:04 am in Bathrooms Forum

First mistake "do'nt gut it". Gut it and second, use a vapor barrier under the cement board, do'nt use greenboard. The rusted nails will tell you where the vapor barrier and cement board prefer to go, I would just put the vapor lock everywhere, use half inch boards. You can use 6 mil plastic or roofing felt as barrier under boards, stapled. I like roofing, a little better insulation sound/thermal.
Cement board is a sponge, if that bothers you do what I did, use a cement board sealer around the shower/pullman area Depot has it. I used epoxy that I get cheap, 80 dollars for 1.5 gallon. That stops moisture before the board and not after.
Next stop tub. Cast iron equals quiet and thermal insulation it memorizes heat, (not drumlike with no echoes) Kohler Villager is cheapest; I say mistake. It is 14 inches tall so beware of a too little tub. I got the Toto 1525 at Express Pipe here in southern cal, 554 dollars. the tub iron is twice as thick as Kohlers I saw also, the glaze is smoother. 2 people can install it (the ground is the third person, roll the tub in end over end or just shuffle it in) 381 pounds but not heavy as you think.
Vanity, ebay has good glass/metal ones, will not absorb odors, lifetime product, under 500 with all hardware, faucets.
The toilet must do one thing foremost, flush. try the Toto Drake and if not the Ultramax will give you much more room. Express pipe or Homeclick. There are some horrible toilets out their beware, get a commercial one, Toto G max for instance.
Porcelain is king on tile, Ceramic is ok, check the grade (1-5) Marble is ok for a bathroom floor awesome visually. I would use 1/8 grout line porcelain on shower with sanded grout. Unsanded might shrink. Keep sponge dry, use caulk in tile corners, do not use premix wet mastic under tile, use powdered thinset with latex additive.
You might want to leave in the cieling when you gut.
You might want to get some kilz and paint the studs around the shower area if moisture problems were evident.


clipped on: 11.26.2010 at 10:58 am    last updated on: 11.26.2010 at 10:59 am