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BusyMom2's New Kitchen

posted by: BusyMom2 on 11.30.2005 at 01:46 am in Kitchens Forum

Whoo Hoo! Like others I am 99.9% done. I have NO idea what I plan to do for window coverings...but oh well! I cooked Thanksgiving Dinner in this new kitchen and it was wonderful! OK, here are the specs...

Bosch Integrated Dishwasher

Kitchenaid Range Gas Convection

LG Cabinet Depth Fridge w/water dispenser

Rohl Pull Out Sprayer Faucet

Rohl Country water filter

Alia Single Bowl Sink

Ventahood Island Vent

Sharp Microwave Overcounter R1214

Bianco Romano Granite

Cabinets: Cherry (equal parts Cordovan & Brite Red Stain)

Island: Benjamin Moore Vintage Taupe oil based paint

Island Top: Jatoba wood (16 pts Cordovan & 8 pts Brite Red stain)

Cabinet Hardware: Top Knob Brushed Nickel

Island Cabinet Hardware: Schwab Cup Pull and Drawer Pulls, Alno both in rubbed oil

Pendant lights: Bruck Rainbow glass (large one)

Dining Room Lights: Schoolhouse Electric Website:

I am sure that I've left something out (or typed it wrong) but I hope this helps someone. This website was such a big help to me so I too hope to return the favor!

Here is a link that might be useful: BusyMom2 Kitchen


old link, try snapfish
like the dark cabs with countertop
clipped on: 08.03.2006 at 07:48 pm    last updated on: 09.30.2007 at 03:53 pm

RE: Size of Island sink (Follow-Up #1)

posted by: cpovey on 01.07.2007 at 11:17 am in Kitchens Forum

I had the same problem, and ended up with a roughly 15" sink, which works fine for me.

The BEST thing I did was to get a sink that has a rear corner drain. It is AMAZING how much space this free's up in the cabinet underneath. Because of the rear cornert drain, I was ablt to get a full-sized (13 gallon) trash can in the sink base, as well as the sink, large disposer, lots of plumbing, and still more storage space. I could not have fit the trash can in with a typical center drain.


clipped on: 01.09.2007 at 11:02 am    last updated on: 01.09.2007 at 11:02 am

RE: Aqua blue soapstone (Follow-Up #38)

posted by: akrogirl on 11.21.2006 at 08:54 pm in Kitchens Forum

Our sample of Malibu Green finally arrived today from M. Teixeira, and it is every bit as gorgeous as it looks in Mondragon's pictures. DH loves it as well, so we will probably try to go with that for our perimeter countertops, IF we can get it shipped and installed, and IF the cost isn't too prohibitive, lol.


clipped on: 11.21.2006 at 09:22 pm    last updated on: 11.21.2006 at 09:22 pm

RE: Scherr's cabinets (Follow-Up #4)

posted by: groschuni on 08.10.2006 at 04:56 pm in Kitchens Forum


Hi. I've posted this before but it looks like it has disappeared, but here is our experience with Scherr's for your perusal:

Scherrs service and quality was excellent. I had gone to several big box stores and kitchen cabinet companies before I found them. I knew I wanted frameless -- its all I have ever bought for the last 20 years -- so a lot of the companies couldnt help me since they didnt carry frameless. Of all the frameless companies I looked at, the line that fit my needs the best was Crystals Quest line. The problem was that there were just too many custom charges in my kitchen design. Crystal charged less than anyone else for these, but even so it was getting very pricey. When I found Scherrs I was in hog heaven. I could have exactly what I wanted and more for a mid-range price. The Lord was smiling on me and I was ecstatic. And I would say that the quality of the cabinet I got is as good as or better than Crystals, which is generally considered up there. Heres a rundown on our experience.

When I first contacted Leon Scheer, I pretty much knew exactly what I wanted. I had been futzing with the design and layout for years until I could afford to do something. If you want them to bid on the job, you really need to know what you want because they calculate the project by the square cabinet foot. I ordered a sample door in the style I wanted and they shipped it out fairly quickly. They reimbursed me the $18 for it when I made my order. Since I talked them into doing a 5/4" drawer front they had never done before, they sent me a sample of that at no charge, just to make sure it was what I wanted. Ultimately I put the sample door on the side of the appliance garage (see pic above) and I burned the drawer front in a ceremony to appease the kitchen gods (which worked pretty well as I had very few problems after that ^_^).

I ordered my cabinets at the end of May and kept changing minor things right up to the point they went into programming in July. You can make changes after ordering (which I think I did about ten times, LOL), but if the project has already gone into programming on the CNC computer then they will charge you for the change. As luck would have it, after they were in programming I realized that the dimension of the drop-down ceiling to clear the pipes in the corner cabinet was off after I pulled out the old wall cabinets and tore out the soffits. I had to make a change to it and they charged me for reprogramming that. But all the other changes were not charged.

I drew up detailed layouts and cabinet designs (using a drawing program on my Mac) to make sure they knew exactly what I wanted. It all depends on how complex the job is. They will work with you on the design if you need some help, but they are not primarily kitchen designers.

We collaborated on how the clipped corners would be designed. I told them how I wanted the partitions in the glass front drawers to work so that I could move them to adjust the space there. I also designed a way for them to make the short shelves on the doors of the pantry and spice cabinet adjustable while locking in place.

I wanted to integrate the plugs and light switch into the cherry backsplash on the island (see above) and I sent them drawings of what I wanted and told them what it was for. They went out and bought a Lutron plug so that they could fit it properly. The backsplash is actually the switch plate for these three things. Wiring the island was tricky. I used a router to route out channels for the wires to run through so they wouldn't be inside the cabinets. I basically sandwiched the wires between the front cabinets and the back cabinet. The specially made back cabinet had a 3/4" solid back on it that gave me the room to do this. I put an outlet inside the drawer stack on the right side to hide the wall wart for the phone and I also put the phone jack in there. The wires run out a small hole under the overhang up to the phone (you can see them above). To do this kind of thing you need to be able to use a router and a jigsaw.

I originally was going to fabricate these valance pieces over the window myself, but they suggested they could do it for me and it wouldn't cost that much, so they did the work there for me and I only had to assemble it. Anything you can think up, they can pretty much do it. The one thing they did not do for me is the grill in the toekick for the HVAC. That I got online from Cape Cod Air Grills (

The cabinets shipped in August and took about a week to arrive. Each cabinet is shipped flat but wrapped up together for easy management of the logistics. Hardware is wrapped separately as a group. Scherrs supplied all the crown and door moldings and fabricated the valance box for me as well, though I was originally planning on doing that myself.

I stored everything in the garage until I was ready to move it into the house. I then unwrapped everything and organized it all in the living room.

I opted for "select" woods with a clear catalyzed varnish on the natural wood. I didn't really consider anything else except maple and cherry because I really liked the combination together. At the time, maple and cherry were the same price. Now, I believe that Cherry is a bit more. The natural maple dominates our installation with the natural cherry creating interest in the moldings and toekicks and in the island.

I had Scherrs do the finishing. If you want a special finish or stain, they can send it out, but I expect that it will increase the lead time. They can also leave the doors unfinished if you want to finish them yourself. The finish on the cabinet doors was very smooth without any swirl marks. The only problem was that there was some varnish spray dust that needed to be knocked down with a piece of cardboard. A miracle cloth probably would have worked also, but I had no idea they existed then. After this bit of maintenance, the finish was like silk.

The drawer boxes are maple, I believe. Not select, obviously. They are not likely any more sturdy than the melamine drawers they offer, but I really like the look of them. Scherr's offers them unassembled and unfinished if you want to save some money, but I opted to have them assemble and finish them, as I felt they would do a better job and I just didn't want the hassle. The larger drawers have a central beam of wood under the bottom for extra support. They are put together much better than anything I have seen in the big box stores. The dovetails are practically smooth to the touch. Beautiful fit.

I opted for full extension Tandem undermount glides which I strongly recommend. They are so smooth and solid feeling and there's nothing like being able to get in the back of the drawer without contortions. I have since installed a few Blumotion mechanisms (there's now one on the drawer above), which are really great.

I ordered the cabinet box with unfinished wood edge banding, which I felt I could finish pretty easily, and it saved me about $400. I also liked the look of the wood on the edge better than the vinyl edge banding you usually see. Even though the cabinet boxes are melamine, this little touch makes them look very classy.

I asked about upgrading to plywood boxes and Leon told me that it would be a waste of my money. This was from someone that would benefit if I opted for the upgrade. He said he installed melamine cabinet boxes in his kitchen 20 years ago and they still look like new. The glass front cabinets are plywood and the sides with finished ends are plywood. Otherwise everything is their furniture grade 45lb particleboard with melamine laminate and wood edge banding. I have never regretted getting the melamine. It is very easy to care for.

Since the cabinets are cut out via a computer controlled robotic system, the parts are made very precise and the fit is very tight and square. Even though I checked them for square when I was assembling them, they were already square after I had tightened them up with the clamps.

The CNC programmer (Leons brother) only made one mistake and that was on the special cabinet (above) I designed for the back of the island. This was not something they had ever made before since I incorporated two angled cabinets on each end and a 12" deep by 24" wide standard cabinet in the middle into one cabinet. The programmer put the holes inside the cabinet in the wrong place for the hinges for one of the doors, but I didnt make an issue of it. You can just see the wrong holes in front of the hinges in this picture before I filled them in. They would have sent me a new part if I wanted but I just drilled new holes for the hinges, which was no big deal. After the above picture, I filled in the old holes with colored touchup wax and no one has ever noticed them since.

Putting the cabinets together is not really very hard. If youve ever put together an Ikea product it should seem familiar. Fairly decent instructions are included with the cabinets. You will need to buy a couple of good bar-clamps like 40" Bessey K-body clamps. They are about $40 apiece. It will help you pull the sides together properly when you are assembling. You will need at least two. Four would be ideal. You will need a rubber mallet, a power drill/screwdriver and a spray bottle for water. I would also suggest that you buy a template for drilling the holes for the cabinet pulls or knobs to make sure they are positioned consistently. I bought an adjustable one I found online at called Euro Handle-It that worked really great for about $40.

The cabinets are joined with self gluing dowels, cam locks and screws. Once assembled they are very sturdy. I went a step further than most in putting ours together. I sanded and polyed the raw ends of the shelves and sides to seal them. Of course this isn't really necessary, but I felt that it would help protect the cabinets from humidity and liquid disasters. I also caulked around the inside of the sink cabinet to prevent water from leaking down into the furniture board should the plumbing spring a leak. This has saved me some trouble as I had two undercabinet filters fail on me and slow leak into the cabinet bottom, but because of the caulking I had no damage. I am so glad I got melamine for the sink cabinet, because if I had gotten plywood, the finish would have been damaged by the standing water. As it was, I wiped it out and it was good as new.

Installing cabinets ideally is a two person job. I put plywood up on our walls instead of drywall where I would be mounting the cabinets to make it easier. That way I didn't have to worry about where the studs were when I mounted the wall cabinets. I temporarily mounted a level 2X4 ledger board to the wall to sit the cabinets on while I was mounting them. This made it easy to keep them straight and made it much easier to mount them. Scherrs ships cabinet wall mounting screws and special male/female cabinet screws for cabinet to cabinet joining. Once I clamped the cabinets together, I drilled a 3/16" hole for this joiner in between the screw holes for the cabinet doors to hide it. Nearly all of them are hidden this way. BTW, dont use drywall screws for mounting cabinets because they are too brittle and could fail on you.

I opted for adjustable legs for the base cabinets. It makes it much easier to level them when you are installing. When the granite fabricator came to measure for the countertops, he was surprised at how straight and level the cabinets were. He wanted to hire me to do cabinet installs. It was all due to the adjustable feet.

I only had to replace three pieces. One 33" 5/4 solid drawer front had warped (not unusual); the piece of molding capping the knee wall had been damaged in shipping when something like a small rock got between it and another piece and caused some serious scratching; and one of the wall cabinet doors had an objectionable stain on it. All pieces were replaced promptly with no question.

One other piece I had them replace at *my* expense came from an accumulation of errors in the cooktop base cabinets. The walls in that corner are not square, so the Super Susan corner cabinet didnt fit in exactly 36". That combined with other minor errors in my installation made it so that the applied false door I had planned for the end of the run would stick out beyond the wall just enough to drive me crazy. I called Leon and asked if they could do an integrated raised panel side for that cabinet and he said no problem. They rushed it through production and I think I had it in less than two weeks. I swapped out the old side of the end cabinet (see above) and got it reinstalled just in time for the installation of the granite, so it didnt even slow down my schedule. And the end result looks even better than I originally planned plus I kept an extra 3/4" in the drawers! Happy accident. I didn't burn that drawer front for nothing, ya know, LOL!

To clean up the undercabinet wiring, I had them bore 5/8" deep 2-3/4" diameter recesses in the bottom of the cabinets so I could recess the undercabinet lights. They drilled a 1/4" hole from the back of the cabinet through the bottom to the recess for the low-voltage wire. I also had them route a 1/2" deep channel in the back of the bottom for recessing the plugmold to make it more inconspicuous. I was very pleased with the results (see above).

I put pullouts over the fridge and they work well to get to things in the back without moving things in the front. However, you still need to get up on a stepstool to get in there. If I were to do it again, and I might, I would make the bottom of those drawers out of Plexiglas so that I could see what was in there from below. Those pullouts use zero protrusion hinges on the doors so that the drawers are the full width of the cabinet. The hinges move the door completely out of the way of the drawer. That way you don't lose the space on the sides that most pullouts do. (You may be able to see in the picture above that the melamine sides have a wood edgebanding on them.)

This wall EZ-reach corner cabinet was what led me to Scherrs. Because it was so oddball, all the semi-custom cabinet manufacturers wanted an arm and a leg for it. It is 29" wide on the left, 24" wide on the right, 12" deep on the left and 14" deep on the right. It is 35.5" tall with a 3" dropped down top but full height doors. Try pricing that with Kraftmaid or some other company and you will see what I mean, if they will do it at all.

For 22 cabinets using select cherry and maple with full extension dovetailed drawers, vertical tray inserts, silverware drawer, integrated finished ends, clipped corners, soffit over the sink, window seat, molding around all the doors and windows, cherry crown molding throughout the area, special 5/4 drawer fronts, various drawer partitions and extra shelves I paid $15,000 delivered. This was about $5,000 cheaper than the only other cabinet company I had found that came close to doing what I needed (not including installation). I couldn't use IKEA, I couldn't use Premier, I couldn't use many of the other cabinet companies I looked at because things just wouldn't fit right. As I was finalizing the kitchen design, Scherr's recommended I make the wall cabinets 35.5" high instead of 36" to fit the crown molding better. Ironically, that cost me less money since they charge by the square foot. Try that with any semi-custom cabinet company and it will practically double your costs. I added a lot of extras with my kitchen with the fluted clipped corners and integrated finished ends, etc. If the design had been simpler it would not have cost nearly as much, but we are more than delighted with every dollar we spent on them. I'm just grateful that I was able to get together the money I needed to do this right, as I doubt that I will ever do it again, at least not in this lifetime, and the finished kitchen is a continual source of pleasure for all our family. That's priceless. Scherrs did a number of special things for me that they had never done before, like the clipped corners, and they pulled it off flawlessly. They are real craftsmen that take pride in their work. And all things considered, I think they did it for a very reasonable price.

Anyway, good luck and let me know if I can help anyone. I'll be glad to give you any more advice on assembling them that you may want if you decide to go with Scherr's, and I hope your project turns out even better than ours.

Here is a link that might be useful: More photos of our kitchen


clipped on: 09.12.2006 at 12:27 pm    last updated on: 09.12.2006 at 12:27 pm

RE: Where is that 'final cost ' thread? (Follow-Up #6)

posted by: californiagirl on 08.30.2006 at 06:45 pm in Kitchens Forum

I emailed you that I have that thread, gellfex, but since there is interest I am posting it below:

How much did your kitchen REALLY cost??
Posted by sarahandbray (My Page) on Sun, Apr 9, 06 at 11:53

I know this is a terribly personal (and very tacky) question, so I do apologize in advance...but I feel really weird asking a few of my friends/family in the "real world" how much to expect from a complete kitchen remodel. Honestly, my DH and I have NO IDEA what to budget for this thing. He keeps asking me how much I think it's going to cost, and I have not a clue!!
I'll totally understand if this thread has no posts on it--but I was just curious to see what we should be ready will mean the difference between somewhat draining the savings account left over from the sale of our last house or refinancing!!

And as a way to humbly skirt my very tasteless question, would anyone like to take a ballpark guesstimate on mine? We have somewhat caviar tastes on a tuna budget (I know that's not the correct phrase...can't remember it right now!!).

--total remodel of 17' X 17' kitchen (only thing staying is original hardwood floors...but will have to be refinished)
--demolition down to the studs by us--removal of a small wall (see white paneling)
--Everything else contracted out (except painting)--I will act as GC
--probably no island due to space limitations
--mid-upper range cabinets (inset, painted, recessed) with a handful of bells & whistles (bottom drawers, spice rack, small pantry, etc.)
--all new appliances (either SS or paneled)
--soapstone counters
--two new windows
--and probably some unforseen costs due to reorganizing placement of existing appliances and just the fact that the house is late 19th c.

I know there is no way to give a really good estimate since we obviously have nothing much pinned down yet in the way of cost, but I'll take any guesses!!

I've posted these lovely photos of the kitchen before, so I'm sorry if you're bored with this project already (and we won't even be getting started until the tenant moves out of it in July!!!) If you think you're bored, you should see the glazed look in my husband's eye when I start talking "kitchen" with him!!!

Sarah from Selkirk, NY

Follow-Up Postings:
RE: How much did your kitchen REALLY cost?? log in what is this?
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Posted by whitevenetino (My Page) on Sun, Apr 9, 06 at 12:04

A small fortune, IMHO. But you only live once . . . .

RE: How much did your kitchen REALLY cost?? log in what is this?
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Posted by emmie9999 (My Page) on Sun, Apr 9, 06 at 12:26

I can completely understand your question, and it's similar to what I have been asking myself about my kitchen. If it's of any help, I can let you know what we are doing. Our room is smaller, and we don't need appliances, but it may help for comparison purposes. We are doing the following:

-build 4x10 foot extension behind the stove wall (exterior) on concrete pilings.
-gut existing kitchen (10'6" x 10'9") and mudroom (6' x 6')back to studs
-reinforce ceiling near addition with beam
-move stove to center of new exterior wall, extending gas pipe
-install micro/vent over stove, venting to outside
-replace 3 outlets, add 2 more
-replace 3 can lights, add 3 more (this is still up in the air)
-insultation throughout
-sheetrock, mudding, etc
-assemble and install Ikea cabinets
-reinstall DW, install sink
-install countertops (laminate was first budget, we are now considering soapstone)
-new subfloor, laminate flooring
-tile backsplash

Our first contractor (whom we trust VERY much) priced the whole thing at $34K. However, that was using Kraftmaid cabinets, since he isn't familiar with Ikea and struggled with the pricing for them. The money we saved on cabinets will go into soapstone counters, so we break even or drop that price a little bit.

We have gotten two other estimates so far, and they have been around $16-20K NOT INCLUDING cabinets, countertops, flooring cost. The contractors told us: if it's something you pick out, you pay for it. My price covers the labor to install it.

I'm NW of Boston, and I do know location does something to the cost. But maybe this will help you a bit. My suggestion to you is to have a GC or two come in and give you estimates. That way, you have a basis of comparison for yourself.

Good luck!


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Posted by bunglogrl (My Page) on Sun, Apr 9, 06 at 13:22

Check out grant13's post in the gallery. He(?) listed brands and prices for the entire job.
I don't know where you are but I can make some price guesses based on my research in the SF Bay Area. Ours was supposed to be a DIY project last winter, but the cabinets came too late. Now DH is too busy with work and I'm too impatient to wait until next winter so I've been interviewing & hiring subs like crazy the last few weeks!

17' X 17' floor refinishing ($5 sq ft.) -- $1500

DIY demolition dumpster for 1 week -- $500

Everything else contracted out
electrician -- (3 days at $100ph) $2400
plumbing -- (2 days $100ph) $1600
drywaller (replacing lath & plaster would be 4times as much) -- $500
carpenter to hang cabinets, molding etc. -- $2000

midrange cabs with upcharge for in$et & paint -- $30,000
*caviar* appliances, sink & faucets -- $20,000

soapstone counters installed -- $5000

new light fixtures, outlets, switches -- $2500

DIY backsplash -- $1000

DIY paint & supplies -- $300

two new windows -- no clue

and probably some unforseen costs due to reorganizing placement of existing appliances and just the fact that the house is late 19th c. -- $3000

Total: $70,300 plus 10% if you pull permits for electrical, new vents etc.

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Posted by lulashoo (My Page) on Sun, Apr 9, 06 at 14:16

I don't know how much my kitchen will really cost, but I do know I'll be spending a lot because of the kitchen project. In other words, "well while we're at it..."
... let's have the cabinet guy do laundry-room cabinets, too.
... let's have the carpenter re-do the walls in the dining room, since it's practically part of the kitchen.
... let's have the cabinet guy do new dining room stuff to go with the new walls.
... let's replace the window in the den since we're doing new windows in the kitchen and the guy is here anyway.
... let's plan ahead for the deck reno (who knows when) and turn that window in the den into a door since we're having windows done.
... since the den is torn up from the windows, let's re-do the moldings throughout to those that I like.
... then we'll need to repaint the den.
... which flows into four other rooms, so they'll need repainting too.

The kitchen itself is not the problem, you see.

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Posted by heybuddy (My Page) on Sun, Apr 9, 06 at 14:57

We are doing ours all alone. We will buy the cabinets and counter and have the counter installed, everything else is all us, thankfully DH can do plumbing and electrical. We'll pay a few friends to help with little things such as moving a door up a few inches to level the floor. I started by pricing things and then made myself a spreadsheet in excel. The spreadsheet has five columns: the purchase (i.e. range, hood, door, wiring, etc), estimate $, actual $, value $, and difference between value and actual (so I can get excieted about what I saved). I priced everything at least two places (or more if I looked on the internet) and went with the lower place. My estimate to start was $26,200 and that is tearing down to the studs, including the floor. So far I should have spent $9244 but have only spent $5879 and I have a Blanco sink, Grohe lady lux faucet, Pro333 garbage disposal, knobs/pulls for cabinets, Jenn-Air SS dishwasher, Jenn-Air SS fridge with bottom freezer, Kenmore 36 inch gas stove, 2 storm doors, Broan prostyle range hood and blower, broan soffit for hood, and broan SS backsplash. The big tickets items I have left is the floor (cherry laminate which I have estimated at $1200) and the counters and cabinets (maple Showplace cabinets and silestone counter which I have estimated at $11,500). It's tough to figure out at first that's for sure but search and shop and read alot. Make a budget and try to find bargains where and when you can. I've been buying one item at time for several months so I can pay cash for everything as I go. It's kind of fun to search for the bargains. I'll buy my flooring in two weeks when I have more cash set aside. Hopefully we'll start soon, we were waiting for warm weather since we have to take the kitchen door out and move it up.

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Posted by house_vixen (My Page) on Sun, Apr 9, 06 at 16:30

Labor costs will make a big difference. I'm in a small city with ~$75/hour electricans and plumbers.
SS or paneled appliances could be anywhere from ~6K (for say, Frigidaire) to infinity (g). If you're doing windows that match your house's era, have smelling salts handy when getting bids.

Guessing here, but I'd say you won't get away for much less than $50K, and it could easily be $20-30K more.

With two baths to do in our 1905 place, we went with a rather frugal*, mostly-DIY, budget kitchen reno. We didn't go with a period look per se, opting for a "re-interpretation" as my more generous old-house Invisipals call it, LOL. You will be amazed at how all those darling sweet period elements bludgeon your budget, but there are ways for purists to do damage control if they research to death and have patience. [<----- not our forte]

In our case, we were ok with just getting the kitchen to be a place to cook and spend time--it wasn't a "dream kitchen overhaul." So we found deals of the aforementioned Frigidaire appliances, used a few stock cabs from Home Depot, rehabbed an existing hutch for storage, and sucked up the inconveniences the floorplan created. Even that ran nearly $10K--contracting out rough plumbing and electric and using experienced installers for our old-school natural lino was about 2/3 of the budget. [And we still need a new door and a more user-friendly period window over the sink....]

Good luck! You may consider starting a "Period kitchen on a budget? Help!" thread here...that should bring those who've BTDT out of the woodwork.

* Frugal in the world of kitchen renos!

Here is a link that might be useful: !!! ~ 10K doesn't go far enough...or, Vix's budget reno

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Posted by angc (My Page) on Sun, Apr 9, 06 at 16:37

Like you, I wanted a period look with really nice details, but was willing to DIY as much as possible. Here's our budget breakdown. We didn't tear out to the studs though and I really shopped around for the best prices.
Cabimets $11,150
Labor $3850 (cab installation and electrical)
Appliances $3,880
Countertops $2250
Flooring $1060 (DIY removal of tile floor, DIY install of hardwood)
Plumbing $736 (sink, DW, and faucet install plus new gas line)
Tile $390 (Backsplash DIY)
Hauling $200 (Tile floor debris)
Paint $100 (DIY)
Hardware $145
Lighting $160

Total $23,921
I think our kitchen looks much more expensive than it really is. A Realtor guessed it was a 50-60K kitchen!


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Posted by adoptedbygreyhounds (My Page) on Sun, Apr 9, 06 at 17:28

We received three estimates for our kitchen, all based on the same request. Our kitchen is similar in size to yours, mid-range Shiloh cabinets, granite counters, new flooring, sheetrock, cabinets. Appliances NOT included.
We are in suburban/midtown Atlanta and the estimates ranged from $80,000 to $106,000. We felt we were "zip coded" on the $106,000 est. After we were finished adding in the "while-we're-at-it"s, we ended up paying a little over $100,000 and this included extensive rewiring of this end of the house, some exterior painting, a generator, and the like. We naively estimated ahead of time that the entire project would be between $60 and $75,000. Still living in 1970, I guess.

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Posted by dervy (My Page) on Sun, Apr 9, 06 at 17:30

Check out this post...

Here is a link that might be useful: Kitchen budget

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Posted by histokitch (My Page) on Sun, Apr 9, 06 at 18:05

My last house kitchen redo, stud to stud, joist to joist, was $42k. Most realtors when we sold it guessed much more. We are anticipating $50-$60k for our current house, which is our forever house. We won't be moving walls, but my appliance budget is obnoxious.
Here's a link to my old kitchen if you want to see what it looked like.

Here is a link that might be useful: kitchen

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Posted by msafirstein (My Page) on Sun, Apr 9, 06 at 18:05

lulashoo; You sure have that right! We started out with working within existing walls. Then DH decided he wanted a 12' addition, then it was a 14' plus full basement. Then DH decided he did not like our shallow roof and decided to tear the entire roof off over the main part of the house and rebuild it. Then he decided to tear off all of the roof over the entire house and make it all 10:12 and add a huge dormer, this alone added over 900 sf. And just this week it was decided to go 18' on the addition and an extra deep basement. I only wanted around a 3500 sf house and now we are closer to 5500+.
There are many other things when I tried to conserve money and was trumped by DH. I wanted to carpet the entire house, DH wants 3/4" HW floor. I wanted a covered porch along 2 sides of the house, DH wants the covered porch around the entire house. I wanted a small shower stall, DH wants me to have a whirlpool tub. Don't get me wrong I will love the whirlpool but this is another $5,000 plus installation.

And my appliances are costing abt $20,000 and this is what DH is complaining about. Does anyone else understand this?

And to answer your kitchen budget question, I figure my kitchen will be anywhere from $70-85,000.

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Posted by ketinmd (My Page) on Sun, Apr 9, 06 at 18:24

Demo for me starts tomorrow, and it looks like everything will come in around $60,000. Not all that much structural change (adding a second dishwasher and a sink to the island; building a pantry), but everything new: floor, cabinets, granite countertops, appliances except for the oven, which i'm keeping. I'm going for nice cabinets (custom birch, flush inset doors), but mid-range (KA, Bosch) on appliances. I echo everyone else's advice to talk to a lot of contractors. I got estimates as high as $90,000 for what we are doing.

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Posted by drmeow3 (My Page) on Sun, Apr 9, 06 at 19:14

10 X 14.75 kitchen (after remodel).
Tear out walls to studs. Extend one wall about 6 inches and raise ceiling about 8 inches.
Tear out existing ceramic tile floor.
Rewire (including new subpanel for kitchen).
New double pane windows
6 recessed cans, 1 ceiling light, track lighting in dining room (including new wiring - there was no existing lighting in the dining room!).
Combo of Dynasty by Omega and regular Omega cabinets, Guthrie, natural pecan
Pullout drawers in pantry, custom cabinet built by GC with custom drawer and moveable shelf, custom drawers in corner cabinet built by GC.
Kenmore dishwasher, Trio fridge, and 27" double wall oven, GE Monogram 36" cooktop, Zephyr Tamburo hood (custom stainless piece behind and around hood), U-Line Echelon series wine fridge, Sony TV/PC (computer and TV combined in a single unit - pretty cool)
Franke sink, Kohler faucet
Zodiaq engineered stone countertop Borealis Blue
Radiant heat floor, Kaiser tile and some cheap Italian tile for floors, Daltile for backsplash (13" square cut to 5")
Paint kitchen and dining room (didnt like color, had to repaint)
Solotube skylight
Reinsulate kitchen plus add additional insulation in entire attic.
Total cost: @$56K

Here is a link that might be useful: details and before/after photos here

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Posted by yvette123 (My Page) on Sun, Apr 9, 06 at 19:57

For all those on a budget like I was - Here is a detailed list of my spendings:
Demolition: $4800.00 (Total gutting of kitchen to bare studs, installing new drywall and ceiling, adding new insulation, re-directing vent, all electrical work including adding 8 low-voltage 4" can lights, removing two closets, removing and adding some floor tiles, remove and install new window, tile backsplash, install new appliances,
cover up old pass thru to DR and finishing the DR wall, priming and painting kitchen walls) This also included all materials except for can lights which I bought.
Kitchen Cabinets: $17,038.65 Boxes: 3/4" maple Plywood, back 1/2" maple plywood, 1/4" bottom maple plywood, Maple wood shaker doors. (Includes removing old cabinets, hauling them away, installation of new cabinets, Xenon undercabinet lighting and 4 halogen overhead lighting in cabinets).
Applainces: Total cost $7140.11
Bosch dishwasher (shx46A05UC) $893.00
Bosch Oven (HBL5045AUC) $1598.00
Bosch Cooktop (NES736UC) $951.00
Kitchenaid Refrigerator: $2,250.00
Best Broan Hood (K313936SS) $901.00
Delivery $80.00 Taxes $467.11

Granite: Madura Gold $10.50 a square ft. $1463.12

Granite installation: $28.00 a sq. ft. $2838.00 includes hole cut out of sink

Franke Orca sink $507.00 and grid $84.00 with tax $632.37
Brizo Venuto Faucet in SS and soap despenser $436.56
Insinkerator $96.02

Top Knobs: Pulls M534 in brushed satin nickel $7.65 each from Door and Cabinet Hardware depot (very good and speedy delivery) $367.20 and 8 round knobs (M281) at $2.89 each

PGT window: $191.19 (should have kept my old sturdy window and painted white)

Gold Travertine marble 4" squares: $527.00 ($5.95 sq ft)
10 pcs ogee bullnose $15.00 each (ouch)

8 low voltage 4" can lights 50W MIR16EXN $313.13
(could have used two more in hindsight)

Total cost $35,857.12I

I did not use a GC or designer. It was just me, DH, Cabinet maker,handyman and granite guy on this project. The great part of this was that all three commnuicated very well with each other and everything ran very smoothly. They made a great team!

If you have any questions, just ask.

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Posted by basketchick (My Page) on Sun, Apr 9, 06 at 20:28

Well, I am in sticker shock myself. We set out to do this kitchen for $30,000 and we are already at almost $18,000 over budget. Part of this is because we misread the cabinet estimate by over $5,000. This was our fault. The refrigerator (SZ) was over the top. I am regretting it already and it's not even in. I could buy a used car for the price of that thing!
We are GCing this ourself. DH is doing what he can- he took down the soffit, removed the old cabinets, will take up the floor, and is doing the drywalling. But he won't so the electrical or plumbing just in case. And the cabinetmaker will install the cabinets.

We faced alot of problems when we took the soffit down. A sink vent had to be moved. Major wiring moved and redone. A new vent exhaust as we had none and it was a more expensive job than expected because of the way our joists and studs were. This all cost a few thousand. I think we've passed all the overage items though as DH is now finishing the drywalling. Cabinets will be installed on Apr. 17 and we have the costs for everything else, so fingers crossed that it doesn't get any worse!

Appliances: $12,400
Sub Zero 650 Fridge,GE JT915CFCC Wall Oven, GE Advantium Rangehood (got an older one, but new and perfect for only $500!), GE Compactor, U-line Beverage Center, Sears Induction Cooktop, All-Clad Cookware needed for the Induction.

Plumbing: $2,050
EVERHOT instant hot water and faucet, EVERCOLD water chiller, Undersink Water Filter, SS 16-gauge sink & accs. (ebay find for $200!), PP Marielle faucet set, Sink vent, sink installation.

Cabinets: $29,800
Custom cherry cabinets, custom stained glass cabinet door, dishwasher Kit, appliance pulls

Lighting: $3,300
Wiring, pendant lights, recessed cans, switches

Backsplash Tile: $800-1,000 (we'll do ourselves)

Miscellaneous: $619
Exhaust venting, wood, wallboard, misc.

Total Cost of Remodel SO FAR $ 48,000 GROAN!

This is with pricematching and lots of ebay and internet shopping, which I recommend doing as much as possible.

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Posted by momtojoa (My Page) on Sun, Apr 9, 06 at 21:07

Here is our renovation costs. They include moving, electric and running gas into the house from the garage. Also removing one interior wall and closing up an outside wall that held patio sliders and moving those sliders to another wall.
appliances-11,000- Thermador, Viking, KA and F&P dishdrawers
sinks and faucets and accessories-950
hardwood floors-4000
glass for cabinets-280

Just under $46,000.

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Posted by basketchick (My Page) on Sun, Apr 9, 06 at 21:25

Oops! My cabinet price should have stated that it included my Cambria countertops with a wide ogee edge. That was about $5500 or so of the cabinet price.

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Posted by renue (My Page) on Sun, Apr 9, 06 at 23:45

For ours...
-tear out 15 x 14 kitchen; no walls moved, kept flooring
-Wolf DF36 range, SZ, SZ wine, VAH liner, Dacor warm, Micro drawer, U line ice, Franke farm, miele dw--
-granite w/ ogee edge
-added long gas line, built hood over Wolf (12' ceilings), hood has Venitian plaster + plus wood trim (focal pt of kit)
-cherry wood cabs w/extras: 8" crown mold, posts, corbles, wood appliance panels all but Wolf and micro
-lites: new chandelier, pendant lights, under/over cabs + ceiling
-pricy backsplash tile and pricy cab/app handles
Total for construction, cabs, appliances: ~76k

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Posted by dan_and_carolyn (My Page) on Mon, Apr 10, 06 at 0:06

We're right in the thick of it now; I've demo'd the kitchen, cabinets are wainting to be installed, appliances are in the garage.
I refuse to add up the cost thus far. Naively, I figured "heck, if I do it myself, it'll cost, what, $20k? $25k?" I'll be happy if the total ends up at $40k, and that's doing every last stinkin' little thing myself.

If only I didn't love cooking and hate our kitchen so much...



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Posted by jarthcpa (My Page) on Mon, Apr 10, 06 at 0:21

Ouch!!! We are 90% done, and the unexpected price increases keep coming. We live in the SFrancisco Bay Area, so things are expensive out here, but I expected to pay 150K and we are up to 170K. But, believe it or not we have saved a lot of money on various items. But we went with what we really really wanted. I have waited 11 years for my new kitchen, and we were finally able to afford everything we loved. Just remember to add on 10% for overruns and you should be in the ballpark for what you anticipate. (Expected number + 10%==likely number)

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Posted by lorinscott_1 (My Page) on Mon, Apr 10, 06 at 0:45

We did all the work ourselves except for some electrical and installation of granite slab countertops. All new appliances, including Neptune stacking w/d in laundry room and new fixtures in powder room.....upper mid-range painted cabinets, custom window treatments and cushions/pillows for nook seat....flooring, plumbing and honed travertine & tumbled marble backsplash.....came in around $38,000.00.

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Posted by teddi_and_roger (My Page) on Mon, Apr 10, 06 at 1:07

Here's our breakdown (these are the actuals,not the budgeted costs) - we did all the work except cabinets and granite.
Range (Small Viking) $2,936.51
Dishwasher (Bosch) $673.47
Sink (Blanco) $380.45
Faucet (Delta) $146.95
Cabinets (Custom, cherry)$15,210.24
Hardware $326.72
Flooring (Wilsonart laminate) $1,265.40
Plumbing $211.71
Electrical $424.23
Vent Hood (Vent-a-Hood) $971.58
Framing $359.03
Countertops + Full Backsplash $6,899.01
Instant Hot Water (In-sink-erator) $239.99
Garbage Disposal (In-sink-erator) $130.00
Lighting $582.67
Dining Table/4 chairs $1,213.72
Windows/Patio Door $3,115.87
Disposal /Hauling $415.52
Toaster Oven $92.00
Microwave $76.15
Barstools x2 $320.00
Cabinet Accessories $206.83
Painting/Trim $469.38
Misc/?? $393.34

GRAND TOTAL $37,060.77
Here's a link to the pics, I think the size is probably not too different than your remodel. I did a lot of homework before coming up with an estimate. I felt like I'd rather pad the estimate a bit and come in under (which we did!) than estimate the minimum and freak out when the inevitable happens. For example, I listed MSRP in my budget and then shopped my butt off for bargains. It helped when I needed to go over in other categories. I have this all on an Excel spread sheet, which I'd be happy to e-mail to you if you think it'd be helpful. Good luck!

Here is a link that might be useful: Before & After Kitchen Remodel

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Posted by sarahandbray (My Page) on Mon, Apr 10, 06 at 8:07

Thanks SO much for all your replies!!! This is really getting me on the right track. My jaw did hit the floor a few times, but this is coming from someone who started the price for a remodel, naively, at 25K and has been slowly inching up by 5K each time. I think I'm at about 40-50K now, and vowing that I cannot possibly go any higher than that--even if it means scrapping my dream cabinets or counters or appliances. "College fund" + "food on the table" trumps "kitchen remodel", I'm thinking! And on two teachers salaries, we're going to be scrimping and saving to do this anyway! But I am going to make this a really neat, usable, family-friendly, kitchen, no matter what!!
Thanks for all the pictures and very specific breakdowns--that's EXACTLY what I was looking for! I have to really prioritize what's important to me a little more, but I think I will start an Excel Spreadsheet with all of the things I need and start leisurely finding prices when I can.

Again, thanks for all the help!! I'm glad I found this website so early in our process--now, I just need to start playing the lottery....

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Posted by jerzeegirl (My Page) on Mon, Apr 10, 06 at 10:07

My kitchen is a lot smaller - 10 x 10' - and it cost around $15,000. However, there was no construction involved at all and the kitchen is stylistically simple. This includes the cabinets (13 of them, all upgraded), crown molding, and installation, granite countertop (around 55 SF), marmoleum floor, wood and limestone combo backsplash, faucet and soap dispenser, range and microwave (we had the fridge and dw already), a sink and a window shade. We DIY'ed the paint.

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Posted by mlaj2000 (My Page) on Mon, Apr 10, 06 at 11:20

Here is my breakdown. Long ISland NY 12X 12 kitchen
We were mainly DIY. But did have some help with elec, plumbing and granite. It was completely gutted. Nothing was salvaged.

Cabinets $7500
Counters $4400
Floor $2200
WIndow $ 275
Hardware $ 37
Sink $100
Faucet $120
Backsplash $75
Elec $1800
Plumbing $1350
Appliances $5000
Drywall $500
Fixtures $200
French Door $1000
Mouldings and Paint $200

TOTAL: $24,631

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Posted by natewall (My Page) on Mon, Apr 10, 06 at 11:41

I'm glad you posted this question. I'm curious as to what others have spent, too.
We are nearing the end of our kitchen remodel. Here's what we did. It ran about $30,000, we estimate. Kitchen is about 15 X 12, including a small dining area. The washer and drier were in the kitchen, right next to the stove! (PO had it this way). Its a 1963 Cape Cod style house.

1. Gutted two of the four walls down to the studs. Added insulation on the exteriow wall (there was absolutely none!) Removed all old cabinets and four layers of flooring. The room was stripped bare.
2. Replaced an existing 64 X 74 picture window.
3. Ran a 240 V circuit for an electric stove and water/drain hook up in the closet behind the kitchen for a stacked laundry center.
4. Straightened the back wall of the kitchen (it had a 5 inch "step" that made installing cabinets impossible) by adding a wall right in front of the existing wall.
5. Installed new Merillat White Bay cabinets (about 20) and a large matching pantry. (They cost $6,000)
6. Installed roll vinyl flooring ($650)

We replaced the stove, washer/drier, microwave oven, sink. (About 3,000) The only thing we kept was the dishwasher and refrigerator.
7. (This is the big one) Having Lowes install granite counters ($5,000)

8. Added several outlets and ran a new 120 V circuit for the microwave

A contractor began the work and we paid him about $8,000. His work was so poor I fired him. (At some point I may post about that in the "Disasters" section). They did about one third of the work I estimate. I installed the cabinets and did all the drywall finishing and painting and trim work. I did a majority of the electrical and plumbing too. I think if we kept the contractor, we would have spent about $45,000 for a poor looking kitchen.

This is in Northern Virginia.


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Posted by amm8589 (My Page) on Mon, Apr 10, 06 at 11:44

In order to determine what your kitchen will cost, it is best to get estimates/bids from three sources in your area. Cost varies widely, depending on where you live. Anything you can DIY will obviously save you money. Also, get quotes from online resources for cabinets. Appliance costs vary so much that it would be impossible for anyone to give you an idea how much it will cost you. Do you want a SZ or Whirlpool fridge? A Bluestar range or a Kenmore? It really varies.
Good Luck!


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Posted by mjsee (My Page) on Mon, Apr 10, 06 at 12:01

If I were trying to do a "forever" kitchen on a budget...I'd make a priorities list.
What is MOST important to you?

Some things are easier to change than others. Counters are relatively easy to change--so that might be one place to skimp. You can start with laminate--and put in granite or Silestone or Corian when the kids are through college. Cabinets are pretty difficult (and messy) to switch out--it makes sense to get the best you can afford. Appliances go both ways. Most ARE a farely standard size--but there are exceptions. (Subzero fridge, wolf ranges, dishdrawers all come to mind.)

Me? I've got a kitchen I hate--but it doesn't look HORRIBLE and while it doesn't work the way I do--I've learned to adapt. (Clearly--I've been complaining about it for nine years now!) But we also have two kids to put through it has to wait. And I come on here periodically and dream--and learn. Younger DS is a HS Senior--4 years (or so) unitl I can REALLY do this!


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Posted by dmlove (My Page) on Mon, Apr 10, 06 at 12:46

You can start with laminate--and put in granite or Silestone or Corian when the kids are through college
While I completely agree that you have to prioritize, I just wanted to chime in that we used laminate (which I really am not fond of, and wasn't then either) 19 years ago when we last remodeled, because, essentially, we "ran out of money". We swore up and down we'd replace the laminate when we could afford it. Well, it's been a lot of years since we could have afforded it, and we never changed it. Fortunately, we're doing a complete remodel now!

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Posted by jolly__roger (My Page) on Mon, Apr 10, 06 at 20:39

If you cannot do a lot of the work yourself it may well be time to sell and buy a new home.
Life is way too short for remodelling and remodelling and remodelling.

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Posted by shroppie (My Page) on Mon, Apr 10, 06 at 22:41

We did the following for $45K - a complete DIY, except for installation of the counter (I didn't want to risk breaking the slabs)
1. Gutted kitchen - I'd say to the studs, but there weren't any! - to the brick. Removed a load-bearing wall and expanded from 12x16 to 16x20. Studded out, insulated. Added ducts for heating - the old kitchen had one teeny exchange. New electrical wiring. New plumbing.
2. Added a laundry room - laundry sink and Duet pair.
3. Appliances: Jenn-Air FD frig, Aga Legacy range, Miele Incognito, GE Profile microwave and Whirlpool freezer.
4. Custom cabinets from a local, semi-retired carpenter who did great work at a great price. He also made our barstools.
5. Soapstone counters, triple bowl Elkay sink and Newport Brass faucet.
6. Two new entry doors and new basement door
7. Opening up and refinishing of a servant staircase.
8. Tin ceiling tiles
9. Laminate "tile" flooring
10. 14 can lights, under cab lighting and 2 light fixtures.
11. Plugmold
12. New curtains for 3 windows and new rugs.

We actually came in under budget, so I splurged on new small appliances as well: coffee maker, toaster, Kitchenaid mixer and some new Le Creuset

I did a lot of bargain hunting and price matching to get the things I deemed "necessary" in my forever kitchen and have been thrilled with the results.

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Posted by sharon_sd (My Page) on Tue, Apr 11, 06 at 6:39

Ours was a DIY job apart from the electrician, plumber, diamond drill company and insulation spraying contractors. The total bill came in at $21,000CDN or about $18,000USD for a 17 by 10.5 kitchen.
Over half the cost of the kitchen was for the range, DW and drillers to get the vent out through 2' thick stone walls. We got new Bosch DW and Heartland range and kept the 6 year old SZ fridge, giving it a new front panel.

The remainder was for removing and reinstalling walls, Insulating exteriors, major changes to electrical (needed because of bad DIY job by PO's), lighting, cork flooring, new cabinetry (self built), soapstone and butcherblock counters, soapstone sink, installing propane for the stove.

We were $1k over budget because the DW we planned to reuse broke down and needed such a large repair that we bought a new one.

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Posted by kennebunker (My Page) on Tue, Apr 11, 06 at 19:43

My kitchen is in the prep stage but I have some prices. Our cabinets are custom, of maple, about half painted half stained. The cabs run in an ell, 10 feet by 17 feet with most of them running floor to ceiling. The island is @ 3 feet x 11 feet. One section has glass doors, there's a super susan, a 24" wide pantry with pullouts, a pullout shelf in one cab and spice rack pullouts inset into the sides of the "hearth" which encloses the range, and a mess of drawers.I also designed a window surround in there with small shelves that flank the window. Price is $23,800. Installation is under $2000.
My fridge is a 3 door Maytag with ice and water in the door, stainless, and range is a Whirlpool with convection oven, stainless. They ran us $4200.
That's it so far.

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Posted by bichoncoco (My Page) on Tue, Apr 11, 06 at 22:30

I have a very scientific formula to calculate the cost of a remodel. I have used it a number of times and it is always accurate. It is as follows:
Cost that you initially think x 2.5 = Actual cost of project

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Posted by karh (My Page) on Wed, Apr 12, 06 at 0:20

Most kitchens I redo, can run between $20,000 to $55,000 depending on cabinet line, design and countertops. This is pretty much redoing flooring, some electrical, cabinets, some appliances, and countertops. At the low end this would be a Kraftmaid cabinet with a veneer center panel door, maybe a glaze, but a middle of the range layout. Do it yourself you can be in the $10,000 and under range on cabinetry. Countertops can run between $1,000 (laminate) and up, to the $4,000 to $6,000 level for solid surface. Everything depends upon the intricacy of the design and the amount of plumbing and electrical involved. If a customer goes to wall ovens and cooktops, add at least another $5,000 to the budget, for appliances, and cabinetry to hold the appliances. If you go into high end appliances, Viking, Wolf, Gagenau, the budget will increase considerably.

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Posted by ktnwin (My Page) on Thu, May 18, 06 at 13:21

Hmm.... I look at the figures above and am totally surprised how lucky I was. Two years ago, I bought a house with a pretty torn up kitchen, on top of that nothing works, the oven, the range, the dishwasher, even the sink leaked. The countertop and cabinet are laid in an U shape (pretty standard), the kitchen size is 30% larger then the one in the first picture in this thread.
I asked a Sears representative about resurfacing and he gave me an estimate of 15K. So I went out to buy a set of brand new oak cabinets, this includes the pantry and the wall oven cabinet (the cabinet store helps with the layout and the size of each pieces). The cabinet guy moves the old cabinets to the garage (my request) and install new ones (his labor cost: 900$ including moving the new cabinets from the store to my house). I installed the old cabinets in the garage for storage (they just look old but in excellent shape, and later I painted them white and that make them look beautiful).
Then I asked a granite guy to put granite as countertop with granite backsplash.
I also bought new sink (undermounted), new waste disposal, new oven, new countertop range, new rangehood (all good quality ones) and install them myself (this saves quite some dollars).
The total that I paid for all this: 12K, yes twelve thousands dollars and about 2 weeks to get all done. My wife and I were very happy about this. Everyone who visited us were stunned with this low cost.

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Posted by pwdrhdut (My Page) on Thu, May 18, 06 at 22:40

I'm finished. I did Kitchen/Livingroom/Dining room but by far the biggest part of the budget went to the kitchen.
Appliances were a bit over $10K
Soapstone countertops, a round $6k (a bit over 80sqft)
Custom cabinets $16k (Kraftmaid at Lowes was over $13K)
Floors (700 sqft for all three rooms plus the stairway) $4000
Ceiling $3000
Doors and windows $4000 (PLAN AHEAD ON THESE!!!!)
Woodstove and installation $3000.
Many Many other things that were $1000 each (sinks, railings, fans/lighting, plumber, electrician and on and on.
Lowes/Home Depot bills another several thousand
The total which I never added up was between $60 and $70K

Watch for new photos. The cabinet guy comes for his last visit to put the finish on the stair railing and I'll post FINAL photos then!

Here is a link that might be useful: Scott's Kitchen

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Posted by grettie (My Page) on Fri, May 19, 06 at 1:06

since you're teachers, could you DIY (even partly) during the summer break?
we hired a REALLY good local carpenter, and DH was his assistant (also on hand for some crucial decisions.) his rate was high, but his 'crew' was cheap. they did demo, rough and finish carpentry, plumbing and installed cabinets. cheaper if you don't move the plumbing
if you're changing/adding windows and doors, and don't need it tomorrow (like we did ) look for SALES (end of summer) on errors, unused, unclaimed items.

we paid sander/refinisher for floor and electrician

we did KM cabs. went to a couple of home depots- young salesmen/designers really pushing the (costly) bells and whistles. who needs a stack of 6 inch square spice drawers? pull one open and you see tops of jars... At a lowes, i met a gentleman who had installed kitchens, retired, and returned to part-time work . NOT pushy- a cook himself. i revised that design MANY times. think about what and how you cook and IMAGINE yourself using the cabinets and space. REFINE. simpler can be cheaper. i kept pot and pan drawers either side of range and roll out shelves in cab for occasional (but unwieldy) appliances- crock pot, blender, pressure cooker. regular shelves in cab w/ baking pans- they are light and easily stacked. i think accessible/convenient. i like an open look, so i used very few upper cabs, but really made the most of island storage. i use shelves in nearby laundry nook for long term pantry (mostly canned goods). shelves were cheap (never seen) and needed less cab storage space.

how about compromise/saving on appliances? i got the range i wanted (DCS), but was limited to 30". Got a Bosch DW but NOT the most expensive . I thought about the dB/quiet level, and which features i really needed. i'm not a big ss fan. i went w/ white- not leatherette look but glossy white on DW, french door fridge and range. Range TOP is ss, as is exhaust fan, 30" backsplash behind range with ss shelf, and handles on range and fridge. depending on where you live, check for internet for appliances. many people here were very happy w/ cutting edge kitchens- save tax, delivery and, get discount for purchase of mult appliances. (there was a defect in one and they got it fixed instantly! also, many appliances can be upgraded later for same size.

we also put in 'temporary' counter tops (running out of time and money.) laminate around sink, range main prep area. cherry ply on island. i also think these can be upgraded easily. first change will be honed marble counter on the 'baking counter.
total cost probably 40-45k

RE: How much did your kitchen REALLY cost?? log in what is this?
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Posted by renue (My Page) on Fri, May 19, 06 at 2:28

Here is the national average for an upscale kitchen (labor, materials, mgnt fees) as of 5/2006: $81k with a return on investment of $69k or 84%.
Major Kitchen Remodel (Upscale)
Update an outmoded 200-square-foot kitchen with 30 linear feet of top-of-the-line custom cherry cabinets with built-in sliding shelves

* Granite countertops, and imported ceramic tile back-splash
* Built-in refrigerator, cooktop, and 36-inch commercial grade range and vent hood;
* Built-in warming drawer, trash compactor
* Built-in combination microwave and convection oven; and dishwasher
* Install high-end undermount sink with designer faucets, garbage disposer, and built-in water filtration system
* Add new general and task lighting including low-voltage under-cabinet lights
* Install cork flooring, cherry trim. Include a 3-by-5-foot island

$81,552 $69,194 84

RE: How much did your kitchen REALLY cost?? log in what is this?
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Posted by deirdrelouisville (My Page) on Fri, May 19, 06 at 6:59

A huge part of our budget has gone to getting the "box" right-- we combined three small rooms and a hall into an L shaped kitchen with a 34' long leg and a 20' short leg. This meant a 20 foot steel beam and supports in the basement. Also had to upgrade to 20th century wiring and up the electrical service to the house. Ditto on insulation-- there wasn't any, so we reframed the extrerior walls to accomodate R21. To heat the space we are putting in radiant floor in stained concrete.
Our actual costs for true "kitchen" stuff is fairly modest:
Advantium 1000
wall oven 1000 (not yet purchased)
frigidaire twins 1700
uline frig/freezer/icemaker drawers 1800
cooktop 900
waring drawer 500
kohler cooksink 600
fp dishdrawers 1000
additional dishwasher for pantry 1000 (not yet purchased)
or about 10,000 total

Cabinets- White quarter sawn oak with full inset, 7000 (the design has few cabinets as many of the house's original 1882 built ins are being reused)

Counters- Alabama white marble (except for cooktop area which is copper) 2000

Sinks/faucets- fireclay belfast sink, undermount beverage center sink, pot filler, wall mount faucet for beverage area, Pascal Culinary faucet for main sink (if it ever actually arrives.....) 1700

salvaged yard 54" copper range hood $250
ventahood 42" insert for hood $600

1907 subway tile for backsplash (mostly salvaged from our own demoed bathrooms, two full baths yeilded almost enough for one small backsplash.

The total bill on the kitchen, a full guest bath and a powder room is running about 110 thousand. So much more than we thought at the beginning of the plan, but we really feel like we haven't shopped hard and gotten the best prices.

RE: How much did your kitchen REALLY cost?? log in what is this?
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Posted by deirdrelouisville (My Page) on Fri, May 19, 06 at 11:39

whoops, I meant that we HAVE shopped hard and gotten the best prices!

RE: How much did your kitchen REALLY cost?? log in what is this?
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Posted by peachieone (My Page) on Fri, May 19, 06 at 12:59

Regarding the new kitchen and pantries, I am not going to include the design and architectural fees, demo, rebuilding (footings, framing, stucco etc), electrical, heating, air-conditioning, permits and deposits for the City etc. etc. etc. because this was a major renovation including a three story additon (the main floor housing the new kitchen) and gut and redo of a large piece of the house which includes where the butler's pantry and storage pantry are. We added two more bedrooms and a few new baths as well as revamped every square foot of the house to one dgree or another. The whole exterior was re-done too. My husband is a contractor and did do much work himself but we did contract out a lot too.
Anyway - here is the kitchen cost breakdown...The kitchen and pantries were custom and came in installed and finished to the lights in the cabinets at just over $60,000. We also have soapstone on the perimeter and pantry countertops which DH fabricated and installed himself. We bought several pieces of soapstone for about $5500 some of which we are using in other applications in the house so I will say $4000 of that was used in the kitchen area. The island has a granite top and it was $2600 installed - which was a real bargain. Appliances (including exhaust and 3 garbage disposals) were just over $30,000 - but we did need everything. Sinks and faucets were about $4,000. Light for over the island should be about $450. There are lots of potlights and we put teak hardwood down all over most of the house and I don't know how to break those costs down to the kitchen specifically but let's add $4000 including paint. Backsplashes are not yet done but I am figuring on about $1800 for the pantry (mirror) and kitchen (still not sure). All new windows and doors throughout the house but the kitchen part would be about $15000 (including French doors at about $8000) I would think. OMG - I have never added this all up before but even without counting all the rebuilding proper we are over $120,000 for the kitchen...scary but it is going to be lovely when it is all done and I am enjoying the heck out of it now. Realtor friends seem to think that we will get it all back when we go to sell one day. Frankly after nearly two years of renovating and living with it all every day I almost don't even care about the crazy amount of money we have spent. I am just glad that the part where I am handing out big checks has slowed down to a trickle and the end of the project is in sight.

RE: How much did your kitchen REALLY cost?? log in what is this?
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Posted by wbgroovy (My Page) on Fri, May 19, 06 at 13:28

Hi, I'm a teacher too. What do you feel like you can DIY? My DH and I bought a 30 year-old house, and have been remodeling for the last three years. It has been a pain much of the time. But we have much more house than we could have had otherwise. And we know exactly what we have in it. Also, try living with the layout for awhile, so you get to know how the house works before making any huge changes.
I think now in our kitchen we are up to around $8,000.00. But we have redone existing cabinets while adding new. Found a discount lumberyard that makes and distributes unfinished cabinets. They are well made, but basic.
Installing pine flooring in kitchen.
granite tile countertops (someone has done soapstone tile)
DIY backsplash in the plan
Took down a wall to build bar area.
DH did all electrical and plumbing (He is in avionics)

The footprint of your kitchen looks good. And it looks like you will have lots of natural light.

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Posted by deirdrelouisville (My Page) on Fri, May 19, 06 at 15:11

whoops, I meant that we HAVE shopped hard and gotten the best prices!

RE: How much did your kitchen REALLY cost?? log in what is this?
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Posted by ellischestnutgirl (My Page) on Fri, May 19, 06 at 16:14

Are your cabinets hickory? They are really beautiful. Brand please?
Thanks, Gayle

RE: How much did your kitchen REALLY cost?? log in what is this?
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Posted by sarahandbray (My Page) on Fri, May 19, 06 at 16:51

Thanks again for all of the frank and candid responses...I had a bad feeling my initial number was WAY off!!!
I really need to focus my search on more economical cabinets now that I've pinned down the size and (I think) the placement of the appliances. I really need to shop around--because I went to the Wood-Mode showroom and loved everything, but am getting the sinking feeling that they are NOT in a teacher's budget!!! The KD wants me to really pin down a layout before he even gives me a general figure, but I'm just thinking it's going to be way out of our league!

We are definitely not going to sell the house, as one poster mentioned, so we are just focusing on remodeling. It has a lot of sentimental value (my husband's grandfather's) and it's big and cheap for this area of NY. We'd never be able to afford this size or quality house again. In fact, my husband (in an only half-joking manner!), wants to be stuffed and put in a rocker on the front porch of this house when he dies!!!

I just posted this on another thread I started, but here's my latest sketch of what I'd like to do...I'm going to obviously see of it's even feasible with a KD, but this is what I've come up with so far (and I'm sure it's more in the 50-60K range...not the 25K-30K range!)


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Posted by nunk (My Page) on Fri, May 19, 06 at 18:06

My guess...and really, it's just a guess off of what we are doing in our own home (in CA) is that you need to expect to spend at least $35-45. Again, it is just a guess, but I noticed you want to add an island with your sink/dw so you need to factor in plumbing issues as well. The only concrete way is to know right now is finalize your drawing (which I read that you are trying to do) and start getting some estimates. Whatever works out, good luck and enjoy the ride ahead! :)


clipped on: 08.31.2006 at 12:55 am    last updated on: 08.31.2006 at 12:56 am

RE: cabinet features and pull-outs (Follow-Up #3)

posted by: talley_sue_nyc on 08.14.2006 at 02:55 pm in Kitchens Forum

several points:
-every "organizing gadget" takes up its own share of space. So interesting pull-outs in the pantry cabinet may *look* neat, and may actually help you divide up the space more efficiently, it will eat up space in ways you won't imagine.

*many "organizing gadgets" are available after market to go in any cabinet--in fact, many cabinet-making companies order their stuff from Rev-a-Shelf or Haefle anyway; they don't necessarily manufacture their own. So you could buy it after-market quite easily (though you might want to plan the cabinet size carefully to make sure it'll fit).

Look at places like: (or, which is a retail source w/ good prices) (Knape & Vogt, makers of Feeney cabinet accessories, and K&V ones)

-Ikea has a reputation for having quite a few organizing gadgets other companies don't.

*a custom guy can make dividers, special pullouts, etc., to fit your space and your needs. And he can also tap into those Hafele, Feeny and Rev-a-Shelf items as well

*a good cabinet installer or carpenter can retrofit almost anything in a kitchen cabinet--whether he makes it of wood, or uses one of those premade gadgets mentioned above.


clipped on: 08.17.2006 at 05:36 pm    last updated on: 08.17.2006 at 05:36 pm

slate countertops?

posted by: lagirl99 on 04.21.2006 at 09:49 pm in Kitchens Forum

I was watching Kitchen Renovations on DIY Network this week and they installed these fabulous-looking slate countertops in one house. They were the most beautiful color (typical slate blue-gray) and looked non-shiny, which is what I want.

Does anyone here have slate countertops? It came in huge slabs, like granite, not individual tiles.

I'm wondering about maintenance, staining, durability, etc.



clipped on: 08.15.2006 at 10:59 pm    last updated on: 08.15.2006 at 10:59 pm

Aqua blue soapstone

posted by: mondragon on 08.04.2006 at 10:46 am in Kitchens Forum

During the period we were looking at soapstone we went to M. Teixeira and when we were there we saw this on display:

I was surprised to find out that not only was the sink soapstone but the blue countertop under it was as well.

Here's a picture of the sample we brought home next to a tile we were considering for the floor:

The sample had been through a lot - I put it over a burner on the stove, I let oil sit on it overnight, same with wine, same with vinegar. I put it in the tub and sprayed it with soap scum remover and let it sit.

M. Teixiera calls it "Malibu Green" and the picture on their "collection" page doesn't do it justice.

Since so many people here love soapstone for its qualities, not just the look, it surprises me that I haven't seen more people using this.


love this soapstone
clipped on: 08.13.2006 at 12:36 pm    last updated on: 08.13.2006 at 12:36 pm

RE: Upgraded cans, huge difference - photos (Follow-Up #12)

posted by: harper on 06.07.2006 at 06:07 pm in Kitchens Forum

catluvr, funny you mentioned black. I was reading up on cans earlier today and found this:

Q: How do I avoid glare from a recessed down light?

Try and stay away from trims with white baffles or reflectors. While these trims widely reflect light, they also produce glare and hot spots. Black-baffled trims absorb glare as well as some of the reflected light, and you can still see the light source when looking up at the ceiling. Alzak reflectors, available in several different colors, absorb glare but are highly reflective. Perhaps, the most unobtrusive recessed trim is the black alzak reflector. The light source cannot be seen unless a person is standing directly beneath the recessed fixture.

*Sources include the American Lighting Association, Realty Times, and Lightolier Lighting.

I was planning on using white baffled trims, but now I think I'll inquire about black.



clipped on: 08.08.2006 at 03:54 pm    last updated on: 08.08.2006 at 03:54 pm

RE: any thoughts? (Follow-Up #6)

posted by: kats on 07.23.2006 at 10:34 pm in Appliances Forum

There's a company called Ferguson's that is nation wide. I know they sell high end appliances. I bought all of my faucets and plumbing from them because they were cheaper and had better service than anyone including online stores (with no deliver charges)


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RE: any thoughts? (Follow-Up #7)

posted by: fecollier on 07.24.2006 at 02:44 pm in Appliances Forum

Bought all my Thermador and Bosch appliances from US with no problems. They were cheaper than and

Also, buying from the internet doesn't mean you can't use your local authorized dealer for service, warranty or otherwise.

US appliance also has scratch & dent and clearance models. While Shalom101 got a good deal, it's not an apples to apples comparison.


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RE: any thoughts? (Follow-Up #4)

posted by: klb_2000 on 07.23.2006 at 06:31 pm in Appliances Forum

I bought a 15" undercounter refrigerator from them, and had no problems--in fact I included a question in my online order regarding whether I would need a separate kit for the door panel, and they called me promptly to discuss.


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RE: QHA Appliances (Follow-Up #4)

posted by: qhaappliances on 06.28.2006 at 04:33 pm in Appliances Forum

This is in response to the two negative postings regarding QHA Appliances in Florida. Both reporting which I believe to be the same person has made futile attempts to discredit QHA, Inc. Both of their reports appear to be the same person because of the new account registration and having the same birthdays.

QHA is a 9,000 Square foot facility with a self contained warehouse, offices and showrooms in North Florida that has no affiliation with any entity in Pennsylvania. It displays products in its showrooms with live cooking demonstrations, working washers, dryers and dishwashers. It can be compared to some of the finest showrooms in North Florida.

All of the brands mentioned in both comments above as not being authorized to sell is indeed misinformation. Contrary to the inaccuracies of the authors, QHA is an authorized dealer, not only for the brands mentioned, but also for everything represented on our website.

It is with no doubt that both authors remain to stay anonymous, whereas if their identity were to be revealed, that would obviously prove them to be the liars that they really are.

As to the regards of the sales person mentioned that previously resided in Pennsylvania, never have I had such a knowledgeable individual with such an outstanding work ethic.

It is a fact that the only consumers that might have suffered a loss with the transference of ownership is the individuals that were reneged on by the present owner of the location formally known as Nicks Appliances in Berwyn, PA. You can find out more information regarding that company just by searching their name on this site.

~The Ownership and management of QHA, Inc.


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RE: QHA Appliances (Follow-Up #2)

posted by: baustin17 on 06.26.2006 at 04:36 pm in Appliances Forum

I'd be leary of buying from them. B4 I purchased from another dealer, I did a little research and found that the owner of QHA (Nick) used to have an appliance store in PA. which went belly up and left a lot of people hanging, at least according to the PA Attorneys General office. My understanding is that he left the state and opened up under a new name. Checking with several manufacturers, such as Dacor and GE he is not even an authorized dealer. My advice is to do the research, and make up your own mind, check with the manufacturers to see if he is authorized. His reputation in PA was not too good. Everyone is entitled to a second chance in life, It is up to you if you want to gamble your money.


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RE: abt electronics, universal akb, aj madison..... (Follow-Up #9)

posted by: seekingadvice on 06.16.2006 at 07:39 pm in Appliances Forum

markw has a good point - check locally first and buy that way if possible. However, I bought all of my major appliances online because my local places were so much higher that it was ridiculous. My refrigerator, for instance, was $3400 out the door from Abt (48" built-in KA) and $3k more locally, plus Abt delivery brought the thing in the house and set it in its niche, whereas I had to pay a lot extra for delivery and setup through the local guys. I bought my double ovens, double dishdrawers, and cooktop from Gochnauers for a price that basically gave me the dishdrawers for free. All in all, I saved many thousands of dollars just on appliance purchases by buying online (though I turned around and spent the savings elsewhere in the remodel, heh heh).

I will say, though, that I think the key is delivery. Inspect each item VERY carefully when delivered and don't accept anything that isn't perfect. Most problems arise from shipping damage/errors.


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RE: abt electronics, universal akb, aj madison..... (Follow-Up #8)

posted by: markw on 06.16.2006 at 04:50 pm in Appliances Forum

I'd just point out that things can go wrong with even reputable online merchants. In my case, I bought drop-in cooktop from Abt and after a sequence of mistakes, some belonging to Abt, some to UPS, I ended up with three (!) cooktops in transit in one direction or the other between Chicago and California, two of them charged to my credit card and Abt unwilling to do anything about it. It turned out OK in the end (I ended up receiving and paying for just one cooktop) but my point is, there are potential problems in dealing online that largely don't exist using a local dealer. The conclusion I reached: I buy anything bigger than a microwave locally. For me, even if there is a premium to be paid, it's worth it to avoid that kind of aggravation. Everybody's going to have a different take on the risk/reward tradeoff involved, of course.


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RE: abt electronics, universal akb, aj madison..... (Follow-Up #6)

posted by: pew1 on 06.15.2006 at 12:20 pm in Appliances Forum

Have made several purchases from Abt and have been most pleased. I would suggest you not make large purchases on line, price can be negotiated over the phone.



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RE: abt electronics, universal akb, aj madison..... (Follow-Up #3)

posted by: seekingadvice on 06.14.2006 at 08:19 pm in Appliances Forum

I bought my built-in fridge from Abt online and it was a very satisfying transaction. I actually called first and asked if they would give me a 10% discount that I'd heard about and they did. They also waived the shipping charge, which was minimal anyway (somewhere around 50 or 60 dollars). This was on top of the 10% off sale they were already having, so i felt I got a great deal. They also held the refrigerator until I was ready for it to be shipped, which was a few months later. I would highly recommend them.


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RE: the orange kitchen? nay. (Follow-Up #30)

posted by: girlwithaspirin on 07.31.2006 at 12:47 am in Home Decorating Forum

Well, 99% of the decisions have been made! I'm painting tomorrow... before choosing my tile. I'm not worried. Paint has been so much harder than tile. So I'm going with Benjamin Moore Iced Marble, a blue-green-gray not unlike Silver Sage.

Someday when I have money again, the backsplash will be Lunada Bay Sumi-E Sesshu. (Quite a mouthful!) This is the tile I've lusted over for about a year, though in a different color.

And here's a vague approximation of how it'll look, with a swatch of the Cementi floor tile in the corner...

Thank you *so* much for all your help. I'm super excited to have this all decided.


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RE: 30 inch base cabinets (Follow-Up #12)

posted by: talley_sue_nyc on 08.01.2006 at 06:50 pm in Kitchens Forum

if you pull your base cabinet sout from the wall during install, it would be smart to first install a supporting "cleat" (or a strip of wood fastened flush to the wall) at the proper height to serve as support for the rear of your countertop.


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RE: By request - make up furniture pieces from cabs (pics) (Follow-Up #5)

posted by: bmorepanic on 07.01.2006 at 10:43 am in Kitchens Forum

The top is 1.5" (2 layers of 3/4", veneered and solid wood-edged).

Budget... ummm ...I upgraded everything - the woods, plywood, matching interiors, etc - for the sheer pleasure of using it and looking at it. I have a small kitchen and all the cabinetry and trim was about 8K.


clipped on: 08.05.2006 at 03:37 pm    last updated on: 08.05.2006 at 03:37 pm

By request - make up furniture pieces from cabs (pics)

posted by: bmorepanic on 06.30.2006 at 01:48 pm in Kitchens Forum

If you choose carefully, you can use stock or semi-stock cabs to achieve the furniture effect if you want it. The cabinets below are by Scherrs.

I love to know the endings first, so this is how it turned out:

Cabinets as built

This is the original elevation for that wall:
Original elevation

You can make the similar things from say Kraftmaid. You may want reduced or increased depth cabinets to emulate furniture. This can cause astounding dollar changes - part of why we used Scherrs.

In kraftmaid
Two of these - one with furniture ends, both increased depth to 15":

Plus two of these - one with furniture ends and it comes in 15 inch depths:

Plus two 96" boards of this molding laid flat and sandwiched between the cabinets and around the bottom edge:

And one of these:

The slight variations in the photo to the plan are:
--For cost reasons, we changed from 1/2" "edges" to 3/4"
--Well, i sorta SCREWED UP and didn't allow for 1/2" change in height for the new floor
--We cased the windows differently than our original plans.

So we had a last minute frantic foot search after the cabinets were delivered because we suddenly had about 1.5" less height and cabinets that were 1/2" taller.

The other wall cabinet drawing is in the link below. It's photo was an in progress photo and the trim molding has since been completed !doing the happy dance!.

Here is a link that might be useful: More detailed drawing of the other wall.


clipped on: 08.05.2006 at 03:36 pm    last updated on: 08.05.2006 at 03:36 pm

RE: Where to Start? websites please? (Follow-Up #2)

posted by: solarpowered on 02.06.2006 at 10:30 pm in Building a Home Forum

Here are a few: (This list works in Mozilla Firefox; I don't know about Microsoft IE.)


Chief Architect software
BH&G Home Designer

Welcome to Punch!
air krete: A Cementitious Foam Insulation
Palmer Industries (Air Krete)
Huber Engineered Woods (Advantech)
APA (Build a Better Home)
Vaproshield (Roofsheild)

Azar Mortarless Building Systems
GrailCoat - Flexible Concete Coating
Grace Construction Products
Home Slicker
That Drywall Guy

American Clay - The Original Earth Plaster
School of Italian Plasters
Texston Venetian Plaster

Constructions Sites & Magazines

Building Science Corporation

FindArticles - Concrete Construction
Concrete Homes Magazine
Journal Light Construction
Fine Homebuilding Magazine
Nation's Building News
Home Construction Resources

John Bridge Forum (Tile)

Steel Framing

Dietrich Metal Framing
Tri-Chord Steel Systems

Excalibur Metal Framing
Tri-Steel Online

Concrete Forms

Conesco (SLC concrete form sales & rental)
Symons Forms
Gates Concrete Forms
SCI Global (concrete forms)
Wallties Concrete Forms

Western Forms
Tuf-N-Lite Forms
Durand Forms
Precise Forms, Inc.

Windows and Doors

Loewen Windows & Doors
Kolbe & Kolbe
Nana Wall Systems
Therma-Tru Doors

InteriorDoors -- Examples of door styles
T M Cobb Doors

Cellular Lightweight Concrete

LiteBuilt Aerated Cellular Concrete
neopor cellular lightweight concrete

Elastizll Cellular Lightweight Concrete
Herculete - cellular concrete
Cellular Concrete LLC

Veneer Stone

Robinson Brick (Veneer Stone)

Buechel Stone
Luck Stone - veneer stone


AVS Forum
PAC International - Sound Isolation Clips

IsoMax Sound Isolation Clip
Quiet Building (QuietRock)
Audio Alloy (Green Glue)
Integrity Gasket
QuietZone Acoustic Batts
Vinyl Noise Barrier

NoNoise--Building Materials


PCA - Concrete Homes
Z-Wall Shear Walls
Structures of USA - Joists & Decking
Buckley Rumford Fireplaces
Superior Clay Corp.


Atherton Appliance
Standards Of Excellence
University Electric
Kitchen Artworks

Amtico Flooring
Blum Hinges, etc
Woodworker's Hardware--Blum
Cabinet Hardware Center
The Edge Countertops, Inc

Universal--Discount Kitchen Appliances
American Aldes Ventilation Corporation
Cabinet Hardware, Kitchen Cabinets, Accessories & Woodworking Supplies
ASKO Dishwashers

Northland Refrigerators
Klondike Case Refrigerators
Roseland Icebox Company
Traulsen Refrigerators
Induction Cooking

Decore-ative Specialties
Scherr's Cabinet and Doors
Maplecraft Doors
Orbit Tool Works - Custom Router Bits and Cutters
Marble City

CookTek MagnaWave Systems
Select Appliance (CookTek)
Garland (Induction Cooktops)
WindCrest Industries
Lightstreams - Beautiful Glass Tile

Scotsman Ice


Target Coatings Inc.
Phelps (a la carte Fuji turbines)
Compliant Spray Systems

Autobody Store -- Painting
Topcoat Supply (Fuhr)
ICA North America (Coatings)
Accuspray's Home
Camger (ILVA)

Five Year Clear

Square D US
Cutler Hammer

Internet Vendors

Dale Electric Supply
WIRE - Electrical Outlet and Supply
Bay Breakers
MilesTek Your Product is In Stock (HB)

Lighting controls

HOLOPHANE Lighting Ssystems
Advance Transformer - Dimmable Ballasts
Q-Tran Toroidal Transformers

Nexlight Lighting Control Systems
Touch-Plate Lighting Controls
GE Total Lighting Control System
Entertainment Technology-- IPS IGBT dimmers
Laner Electric--Leviton 5657 Momentary Switch

Light Fixtures

USA Light & Electric: 2-inch can lights
JTH Lighting
Undercab cable connector

Rejuvenation Lighting
Contemporary Lighting & Modern Lighting : Interior Lighting : Pendant -
Sunfire Lighting Gallery
Hubbardton Forge
Ruud Lighting

Bellacor (Kichler)
Pegasus Xenon Lights
National Specialty Lighting (Undercab lights)


OutBack Power Systems
MidNite Solar, Inc
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Home Power Magazine - Your Small Scale Renewable Energy (RE) Source


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Skillers Workwear
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clipped on: 08.05.2006 at 03:12 pm    last updated on: 08.05.2006 at 03:13 pm

RE: Dark granite + dark sink = too darK? (Follow-Up #1)

posted by: sweeby on 07.01.2006 at 02:25 pm in Kitchens Forum

It sounds to me like you're selecting the details first, then wondering if the overall look is going to work... Picking your favorites from each category and hoping they'll go together.

Now with a granite as beautiful as Blue Volga, it's easy to see why you'd want it. And those apron sinks are gorgeous - the copper ones especially. And Provencal Yellow or Burgundy Lacanches, long steel bar pulls, irridescent glass mosaic backsplashes, copper range hoods and glazed white cabinets are also gorgeous. But if you put them all together, what do you have?

My advice is to step back - way back - and picture what you want your overall kitchen to feel like. Do you want your kitchen to be dark or light? Cozy or dramatic? Monochromatic or lots of contrast? Modern, vintage, retro, country? Find a vision, a feeling -- fix it in your mind; put it into words if you can. And THEN select the details that contribute to that whole.

Now as to the 'too dark' idea, lots of lighting can solve that problem. Just have your different types of lights on different switches, each with dimmers, and you're golden.


clipped on: 08.05.2006 at 12:37 am    last updated on: 08.05.2006 at 12:38 am

RE: Dishwasher drawers installation (Follow-Up #5)

posted by: dadoes on 05.22.2006 at 12:30 am in Appliances Forum

Make an extra effort to get the unit leveled properly *after* it's shoved into place. Get a 5MM socket (unless the size has changed, check the install documentation) for adjusting the feet from inside, and a small spirit level. Check that the upper drawer doesn't have a tendency to roll in or out due to mis-leveling. Beware that the lower drawer (for a double-drawer unit) must be removed for leveling and anchoring ... and working space is somewhat tight due to the hoses.

Also get the unit properly positioned (centered left/right and height adjustment) before installing the anchor screws.

Moisture-proofing the cabinetry interior doesn't have to be an expert-type paint job. Nobody will see. Just slather several good coats of polyurethane all over inside (except the floor, of course).


clipped on: 08.04.2006 at 09:23 pm    last updated on: 08.04.2006 at 09:23 pm

RE: Dishwasher drawers installation (Follow-Up #3)

posted by: whirlpool_trainee on 05.20.2006 at 09:18 pm in Appliances Forum

A common problem seems to be improper plumbing, which can lead to dirty water backing up into the drawers. Make sure whoever will do the installation actually reads the instructions. Ive searched the forum and this is what I could find.

Posted by: DADoES (My Page) on Tue, Nov 8, 05 at 15:17

Plumbing and proper preparation of the installation cavity are the main concerns. The cavity should be treated with a moisture resistant finish such as polyurethane. The drain hoses must make a loop upward beneath the kitchen sink, higher than the connection point into the plumbing.

and this

Posted by: seekingadvice (My Page) on Thu, Mar 9, 06 at 23:00

The biggest downside to the dds is the fact that they are still relatively new to many of the installation and repair guys. The installations frequently get screwed up because they are different - not difficult, but different. I had a problem with water draining into the top drawer when I ran a load in the bottom, and all it turned out to be was a faulty installation of the hose holder. The hoses have a loop that must be so many inches above the floor and mine was too low, but it took 2 repair guys to figure it out.

HTH, Alex


clipped on: 08.04.2006 at 09:21 pm    last updated on: 08.04.2006 at 09:22 pm

RE: Dish Drawers anyone, would love your input!!! (Follow-Up #2)

posted by: razorback_rn on 07.27.2006 at 10:33 pm in Appliances Forum

I've only been using mine for a month but I adore them. They are the absolute best dishwasher(s) that I've ever owned. I'd definitely buy them again.

My only "druther" is that I wish that we had opted for two single drawers for mounting on either side of the sink rather than the stacked pair.


clipped on: 08.04.2006 at 08:49 pm    last updated on: 08.04.2006 at 08:49 pm

RE: With 8ft ceilings, how'd you treat cabients? (Follow-Up #11)

posted by: thull on 06.30.2006 at 04:56 pm in Kitchens Forum

We have 8'3" ceilings, 42" uppers and crown on top. One thing to be aware/wary of, especially if you're DIYing is dealing w/ an old, unflat ceiling. Ours was extremely wavy, and we ended up having a drywall guy float mud down (in one spot over 1") so that the crown could be installed level.


beware difference in ceiling level if taking cabinets or trim all the way to ceiling
clipped on: 08.03.2006 at 09:15 pm    last updated on: 08.03.2006 at 09:17 pm

certifiable ths tko finished kitchen (long)

posted by: thull on 08.03.2006 at 04:07 pm in Kitchens Forum

We finally finished up our remodel to the point where we could move back in a few weeks ago. Have a lot of projects still to be done around the house, but the kitchen and master bath are done enough to show.

I'm going to try to insert pix as I go, so I apologize to anyone on a slow connection. And the photos aren't the greatest in terms of lighting. Taking them at night and keeping a good exposure balance wasn't easy.

The particulars:

Cabinets: Scherr's, doors are shaker with solid center panel in select cherry
Knobs/pulls: Knob Hill "martini" knob (HD only) and Liberty "retro curl" pull (
Range: Bluestar 36" RNB, six burners
Hood: Vent-a-hood SEPXH18-242
Granite: Verde Butterfly, 3cm
Wall paint: BM, color is 1301, I forget the name of the red
Dishwasher: Kitchenaid KUDS02FRSS
Sink: Rohl Allia 6337 undermount
Faucet: Brizo Venuto in stainless w/ soap dispenser
Disposal: Insinkerator 444 w/ air switch
Fridge: Kitchenaid KSCS25INSS
Convection/Micro: GE JE1590
Pendants: forget brand- low voltage amber pyramid pendants from HD
Backsplash: 1x1 slate mosaic w/ "antique grey" outlet covers from Vermont Slate Art
UC Lights: GE Profile fluorescent
Floor: 3/4" oak strip, mixed new and c. '49; Minwax "Golden Oak" stain, Bona Traffic finish

OK, here's the overview. We haven't found counter stools yet, but there's a 12" overhang in the front of the island. It's supported by 3/8" steel bars, and the two center panels are actually doors to a cabinet. The island is roughly 5' x 8'.

Basically, before the project, this was two rooms, with a wall that lined up where the middle of the hood/range is. Left was the dining room, and the kitchen to the right.

Here's the view to one side of the island. Left of the door is the bar (where the plastic lock is on the door). The wall cabs are 13" deep.

The glass-front cabinets house our "company" dishes and various glassware. The 36" wide drawer bases below have everyday dishes, nice flatware, and various trays/bowls/baking dishes.

Here's a couple of closer views of the island and wall w/ the range. To the left of the range is a cabinet w/ tray dividers and a 4-drawer stack. Pot and pan drawers (30", 2-drawer stack) are to the right of the range)

Here's the wall w/ pantry cabs, more drawers, the fridge and MW. The big cab to the L of the fridge has pullout trays. We have another pantry in the laundry room (outside the french door in the other photos), and we haven't worked out what to put in each yet. Drawers to the L of fridge have everyday flatware, punkin gear, and overflow pots/pans. Drawers under microwave have bags/wraps, plastic ware, and colanders/mixing bowls. Above the MW are everyday glassware and misc stuff.

Closer view of the range:

Bad, but closer view of the backsplash:

Next is the sink/faucet/DW. Left of the sink (not pictured) are two cabs, one w/ a Rev-a-shelf trash pullout, and the other a skinny one for cutting boards w/ knives in a drawer above.

And finally, SWMBA (She Who Must Be Adored) aka "punkin," who finally gets to live in her house. She had just (finally) started walking all by herself, but was still doing it "monster style" because she was used to holding someone's hand(s).

Anyway, I've been reading, learning, and finally contributing at THS for several years leading up to this. So, we're really excited to finally be in the home stretch.


love this kitchen
clipped on: 08.03.2006 at 08:47 pm    last updated on: 08.03.2006 at 08:48 pm

Done for 2 years now.......Found this site a little too late!!!!

posted by: athomewith3 on 08.02.2006 at 01:35 am in Kitchens Forum

We have been done with our kitchen for two years now and didn't fall onto this site until just recently. We went in with blinders and was just excited to get a new kitchen. I will be sure to tell friends that are going through kitchen remodels about this site..........lots of good info!!!! Here is our kitchen which was completed in July of 2004.


interesting floorplan-something to consider
clipped on: 08.03.2006 at 08:18 pm    last updated on: 08.03.2006 at 08:18 pm