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LED recessed cans guide for kitchen ...

posted by: davidtay on 01.30.2012 at 01:27 am in Lighting Forum

A collection of tips/ answers
Since kitchens have higher lighting requirements, I like to use 35 lumen per sq ft as a rule to compute the number of lights. If there are additional sources of light that will be used, the output (lumens not watts) from those sources can be deducted from the total.

Placement/ layout
1. Cans should be > 24 to 30 inches from the wall (on center). Most countertop spaces have upper cabinets (typically ~ 12" deep) + crown molding. The edge of the can may be spaced ~ 12" away from the edge of the crown molding (if present or cabinet if there is no crown molding) making the average distance between 26 to 30 inches.

2. Assuming the need for a fairly uniformly lit space @ 35 lumens per sq ft, the cans may have to be spaced closer together - between 3 - 4 ft apart (if all general lighting is provided by recessed lights). A fairly regular pattern is preferable to a random layout.

3. The actual layout of cans will be impacted by the location of ceiling joists, HVAC ducting, electrical wiring, plumbing, ceiling height, fire suppression sprinklers and other obstructions above the ceiling.

The Cree LR6 series lamps do not dim as well as the later models (CR6, ...). ELV dimmers probably work better with LR6 than incandescent dimmers since the total load of the lights may not meet the minimum load requirement for the incandescent dimmer.

Dimmers such as the Lutron Diva CL dimmers work well. The max output is 95%.

Some Choices (in order of preference) and notes
Cree CR6 or ECO-575 (Home Depot branded CR6)
ECO4-575 (Home Depot branded Cree CR4 4" recessed light)
The above are only available in 2700k light color.

Cree LR6 series - including the LE6.

The Cree CR6 and LR6 lamps will not fit into 5" housings.

The standard LR6 behaves more like a surface mount than a recessed light as the LED emitters are close to the surface and the recess is shallow. Some may not like the amount of light spillage (standard LR6).

There is a higher output version of the LR6 that has a much deeper recess.

To prevent the Cree lamps from falling out, the 3 prongs have to be fully extended and a slight clockwise twist made when push installing. The slight clockwise twist will ensure that the prongs are fully extended.

The Cree lamps are currently the best available today (2012).

Sylvania RT-6, RT-4. The lights could be easier to install than Cree lamps as they utilize the torsion spring mechanism. However, the lights do not look as pleasant as the Cree lamps.

The Cree and Sylvania lamps do outperform 26W CFLs (and incandescents) in a standard recessed can in terms of light spread and output as the standard bulb in a can solution traps a significant amount of light. The Cree and Sylvania recessed lamp solutions referenced above have all the LED elements facing outwards so that the effective light output is higher.

The CRI (Color Rendition Index) of Cree and Sylvania recessed lamps > 80.

There is no warm up time required for Cree recessed lamps, unlike CFL light bulbs.

Most recessed lighting is used with flat ceilings. Sloped ceilings would require special solutions such as the LE6 or some other form of lighting (i.e. -non recessed lighting).

Some common objections to recessed can lights stem from
1. looks and performance of traditional can lights (standard bulb in a can)
2. swiss cheese effect from too many holes.


clipped on: 03.01.2012 at 08:34 pm    last updated on: 03.27.2014 at 08:46 pm

RE: Is this staining my marble counter? (Follow-Up #25)

posted by: srosen on 02.28.2014 at 06:37 am in Kitchens Forum

Three apples-I don't think that is rust but some mineral deposit from sitting water in the seam.
I would try this method before you start taking things apart.
Try this as a poultice fold up some paper towels like about six ply. cut them into a square or rectangle that will overlap the stain. place them on the stain and add some bleach.
just enough to wet the paper towels.
Let it sit there for an hour or two. With a gloved hand you can check on it in about an hour.
I see these type of stains within shower stalls often and the bleach works well. It wont damage the seam or the stone.
Hydrogen peroxide 30-40% volume will work well too.
But that needs to be made into a paste and gets left on for several days. The bleach is the easiest way to start.
As far as sealing it goes it may help somewhat in the future but I think it is the water on the surface that is the issue.
The water is getting in the edge of the seam so a sealer wont stop that but may make it somewhat easier to remove.


clipped on: 02.28.2014 at 08:30 am    last updated on: 02.28.2014 at 08:30 am

RE: question about painting prep (Follow-Up #1)

posted by: snookums2 on 12.01.2013 at 12:35 pm in Home Decorating & Design Forum

After getting what you can off, prime with Gardz. It's made for going over adhesive residue. It won't reactivate it.

About Gardz® Problem Surface Sealer

Lock down porous and crumbling surfaces with Rust-Oleum Zinsser GARDZ® Problem Surface Sealer. This low-odor, water-based formula dries to a clear, matte finish, creating a hard, paintable seal over damaged drywall, adhesive residues and other chalky surfaces.

  • Repairs torn paper on damaged drywall, eliminates bubbles
  • Seals skim coats & spackling
  • Protects new drywall
  • Seals old wallpaper adhesive
  • Easy to apply, high spread rate, fast drying
  • Water-base, low odor, dries clear

  • Here is a link that might be useful: Gardz

    This post was edited by snookums2 on Sun, Dec 1, 13 at 13:09


    clipped on: 12.02.2013 at 06:48 am    last updated on: 12.02.2013 at 06:48 am

    RE: Is there a perfect silver blue gray paint color??? (Follow-Up #14)

    posted by: Grace_Nurse on 11.07.2013 at 08:52 pm in Home Decorating & Design Forum

    I agree that the Donald Kaufman "DKC-37" which was written up in the New York Times is rapturously beautiful. It isn't so much cold silver as it is a kind of overcast, Atlantic Ocean color: It's soft blue, with gray and green. It really is something, and I found it to be worth the extra price. Very soothing...I never get tired of looking at it. I'll probably use this color for the rest of my life.


    clipped on: 11.08.2013 at 10:09 am    last updated on: 11.08.2013 at 10:09 am

    RE: Is there a rule of thumb for width of drapery panels? (Follow-Up #11)

    posted by: caroleoh on 08.10.2008 at 10:05 pm in Home Decorating & Design Forum

    My panels will never be closed, they're just for decoration, so when I had them made I was more concerned about how wide the drapes would be when stacked along the window.

    My panels are pinch pleats, and when stacked are about 21" wide on each side of the window. The actual number of pleats is 9 on each side with a 4" return on the side and about 4" from the first pleat. They definitely wouldn't even come close to covering my window, but I didn't want to cover up the window with draperies and didn't want to use up my wall space either, so on my 96" wide triple casement window, the panels cover about a third of the outside casement windows. They go past the window covering the wall about 6". I have blinds underneath them, and really didn't want to pay for more than that in fabric and labor. I think they are a width and a half of fabric, but your workroom can tell you how much fabric you'll need for 9-10 pleats per panel. If you're buying the panels, look for around 9-10 pleats per panel and that will give you a nice panel that frames the window.


    clipped on: 11.06.2013 at 07:48 pm    last updated on: 11.06.2013 at 07:49 pm

    RE: A couple of questions about drapes (Follow-Up #9)

    posted by: AnnieDeighnaugh on 06.25.2012 at 09:12 am in Home Decorating & Design Forum

    Many rods include a hole in the bracket to hang the curtain return without going through the eye adding process...though it's a great idea if the bracket doesn't include it. Returns are important when the rod projects out from the wall and especially if the window treatment can be seen from the side, say when entering a room. So there are instances, as in the "add an eye" example above where you can return the fabric and not the rod, or there are instances where the rod returns for you and you just hang the drapes accordingly.

    If the treatment is such that it leaves the fabric close enough to the wall, then no return in necessary.

    Re pleated drapes, pinched pleats and french pleats are two different things.

    Pinch pleats are where the pinch is at the bottom of the pleat. Very classic...but old fashioned in my mind as I was doing that 30 and 40 years ago. See picture above for a pinch pleat.

    French pleats or brisby pleats are pinched at the top of the pleat. It's a more modern look from the point of view as that's the only type of pleated drape I've seen in the decorating magazines for the last couple of years. IMO they look much better when done with fuller fabrics than with thinner ones.

    In either case they can be hung with or without rings, depending on the look you want.


    clipped on: 11.05.2013 at 03:29 pm    last updated on: 11.05.2013 at 03:29 pm

    RE: Travel to Paris, Amsterdam, Bruges and Brussels any tips? (Follow-Up #10)

    posted by: barthelemy on 08.31.2013 at 08:27 pm in Kitchens Forum

    Hello :)

    I live in Paris and places I go to when I am looking for hardware are :

    Rue de Rivoli
    Metro stop : hotel de ville

    BHV is DIY-oriented department store, with nice hardware selection on 3rd or 4th floor IIRC.

    Au Progres
    11 rue Faidherbe
    Metro-stop : Faidherbe-Chaligny

    Au Progres is an old-school hardware shop. The shop in intself is very nice :) There are nice affordable non-touristy bistros on the nearby rue Paul Bert. I like Mémère au Piano and Au Petit Panisse.

    A la Providence
    151 rue du faubourg Saint-Antoine
    metro stop : Ledru-Rollin OR Faidherbe-Chaligny‎

    A la Providence is another old-school hardware boutique.

    While you are in the area, you might want to tour the covered food market "Marché d'Aligre" on Place d'Aligre. It is a very authentic, popular, non-touristy, food market.

    A shop I like for its atmosphere and choice of home accessories is :
    8 place de Furstemberg
    Metro stop : Saint-germain-des-pres

    Flamant is a belgian brand. But their shop in Paris is the nicest in my opinion. The square where it is located (place de Furstemberg) is one of the nicest small squares of Paris and is worth a stroll for itself. Many posh little home-related boutiques in the area too (Rue de l'Abbaye and Rue de l'Universite).

    While you are in Saint-Germain-des-Pres, eat macarons at Laduree or Pierre Herme ! Pierre Herme is better than Laduree lately, in my opinion.

    Dept store Printemps has a nice selection of cooking ustensils.


    clipped on: 09.01.2013 at 06:45 am    last updated on: 09.01.2013 at 06:45 am

    RE: Perfect Muted Yellow (Follow-Up #28)

    posted by: angeldog on 04.29.2009 at 09:28 am in Home Decorating & Design Forum

    This is my dining room in Dunmore Cream:


    clipped on: 08.28.2013 at 06:46 am    last updated on: 08.28.2013 at 06:46 am

    RE: Light bulbs 101 (Follow-Up #3)

    posted by: AnnieDeighnaugh on 03.02.2013 at 04:44 pm in Home Decorating & Design Forum

    Don't do CFLs outside if you live in a cold climate...they won't light in the very cold.

    Below is a kelvin chart....look for "k" on the packaging and it will tell you how warm the light will be from the bulb...

    Also CFLs do not dim well so if you have dimmers, go with incandescents.

    If you see the bulbs then you might want frosted to reduce the glare, but in chandys, you might want the clear if they are reflecting light from crystals.

    Perhaps the link below will help...

    Here is a link that might be useful: Light bulb buying guide


    clipped on: 03.03.2013 at 08:19 am    last updated on: 03.03.2013 at 08:19 am

    RE: What did you introduce to your GC that impressed them? (Follow-Up #1)

    posted by: Ginny20 on 02.18.2013 at 10:56 am in Kitchens Forum

    Ecosmart 6" recessed LED's from Home Depot. GC suggested CFL's. When he saw these self-trimming, dimmable LED's, he said he was going to put them in his own house.


    clipped on: 02.18.2013 at 04:51 pm    last updated on: 02.18.2013 at 04:51 pm

    RE: help me save these silk drapes (Follow-Up #4)

    posted by: bronwynsmom on 12.29.2012 at 11:14 am in Home Decorating & Design Forum

    I have noodled with the construction of ready-mades (including some from RH) to get closer to the look I like...I've often taken out the side and bottom machine-stitched hems and re-done them by hand, which makes them hang dramatically better.

    I've also bought three panels, split one, and added those half-widths to the outside edges of the other two to get the proper fullness for a given window. (That only works if the pattern is matched across all the panels, or if there's no repeating pattern.)

    And I've done as graywings suggests, and added bulk at the top with strips of interlining - the stuff you use in jacket lapels to make them lie well. The ready-made tape is fine if its width is right for your panels.


    clipped on: 12.29.2012 at 02:32 pm    last updated on: 12.29.2012 at 02:32 pm

    RE: Book or resource on furniture arrangement 101 (Follow-Up #3)

    posted by: palimpsest on 12.20.2012 at 06:45 pm in Home Decorating & Design Forum

    I would look at a book like INTERIOR DESIGN by John Pile. It has some good basic principles.

    There are actually entire texts on ergonomics and "correct" heights and such for things but they are far too specific for most purposes (and out of date somewhat because people are taller and fatter than they were even a few decades ago.)


    clipped on: 12.20.2012 at 07:06 pm    last updated on: 12.20.2012 at 07:06 pm

    RE: Anyone else looking for crisp sheets? (Follow-Up #42)

    posted by: anna (Guest) on 08.02.2011 at 04:27 pm in Home Decorating & Design Forum

    I've been looking for years...tried Wamsetta, Company store percale, Vermont Country store crisp sheets...and here is the link to beat all those for crispness:

    When I first put these on the bed I had to redirect the fan so it doesn't blow directly on the bed, plus raise the thermostat a few degrees. The heat-difference was amazing!

    Here is a link that might be useful: crisp sheets


    clipped on: 09.25.2012 at 06:56 am    last updated on: 09.25.2012 at 06:56 am

    RE: anyone with a yellow kitchen? (Follow-Up #18)

    posted by: rosie on 03.08.2009 at 08:02 pm in Kitchens Forum

    We have low-E glass in our windows, which kills the vibrancy of the sunlight and washes everything with a dirty-gray-green haze. Going for a pale cream slightly on the yellow side that didn't turn a nasty green, I eventually found Sherwin Williams Venetian Lace. In the morning light it's definitely a very pale yellow but warm and pleasant. In the afternoon it's more of a neutral cream.


    clipped on: 08.09.2012 at 09:37 pm    last updated on: 08.09.2012 at 09:37 pm

    RE: Fired up about the x#@% ad that keeps popping up (Follow-Up #4)

    posted by: marcolo on 01.10.2012 at 08:16 pm in Kitchens Forum

    It has nothing to do with adblock. It's spam that appears in every thread.

    Let me tell you about another terrible Chinese import: Pine nuts.

    One day, I tried to buy some Italian pine nuts at an upscale grocery store. They told me the Mediterranean nuts had gotten way too expensive, so they sampled me with a bag of the Chinese ones (I knew the manager). I used them to make dinner.

    The next day, we were meeting an old friend for wine and a nosh. Before we met up, I was positive that my breath smelled like a dog's, because my mouth sure tasted like the other end of one. I popped into a CVS to buy one of those disposable toothbrush/toothpaste things. They look like a suppository with bristles, so I wasn't surprised at how they tasted.

    We're at dinner, and the wine is just awful. Somebody else tries it, says it's fine and takes over the glass. The food was pretty bad, too, and this was an expensive restaurant. The only thing I liked was the fries, although everybody else found them too oversalted to eat.

    Starting to see a pattern, here?

    It wasn't my breath. It wasn't the food, or the wine. Every thing I put in my mouth tasted like a chewed aspirin. Bitter as hell. Sweets. Savories. Coffee. Booze. Everything tasted like chemicals. Only salt was OK.

    Like any self-respecting modern hypochondriacal American, I go home and Google "bitter taste." Up come page after page of hits, all with the same phrase in them: "Pine mouth." It is a mini-epidemic. Seriously. It's called a taste inversion, and it can last for weeks. And it's caused by only one thing--Chinese pine nuts.

    Fast forward a few days, and I've got Mulder and Scully in my apartment. Seriously. Two FDA agents in blue jackets with "FDA" in those huge, white letters on the back. Apparently the helicopters were circling too high up for me to hear. I can only imagine what my neighbors thought. Especially when they emerged carrying a package of pine nuts in an evidence bag. I am not making this up.

    So, the bottom line is, yes, this is a known health issue being investigated by the FDA. No one knows what Chinese pine nuts actually are--they are clearly not identical to European pine nuts, or perhaps they are processed or stored differently. No one can identify what in the nut is causing the reaction, or why some people eating them will be affected, and some won't. Or whether there are any long term effects.

    One thing I do know: if this import came from any other country but China, you'd all have heard about this on the news by now.


    clipped on: 06.12.2012 at 06:01 am    last updated on: 06.12.2012 at 06:01 am

    RE: cabinets to ceiling or not. (Follow-Up #5)

    posted by: tomcarter101 on 04.05.2012 at 11:17 am in Kitchens Forum

    I too have a small kitchen with 100" ceilings. We are going to the ceiling, using the last 4 inches for a two piece simple crown moulding. The two piece aspect is important as it consists of a vertical and an angled part, the vertical attaching to the cabinet, the angled to the ceiling. Any discrepancy from cabinet to ceiling is adjusted for by the moulding. Simple, effective, inexpensive and allows for max space usage.


    clipped on: 04.06.2012 at 06:49 am    last updated on: 04.06.2012 at 06:49 am

    RE: When is a 4 inch light not 4 inches? When it's a Cree! (Follow-Up #6)

    posted by: lee676 on 11.19.2011 at 06:57 am in Lighting Forum

    Well you missed what may be the best 4" LED module there is - the new Cree CR4 !

    Well, sort of. They don't call it a CR4, but for all practical purposes, the new Ecosmart ECO4-575L is the new little brother of the highly-regarded CR6. For whatever reason, Cree doesn't seem to be selling these under their own brand name yet, but just as well since Home Depot's Ecosmart-branded versions are usually less expensive, and appear to be identical except for a slightly shorter warranty.

    The ECO4-575L somehow managees to be just as bright, and maybe even more efficient than its larger relative. The box shows it draws only 9.5 watts (one watt less than the CR6), and matches the CR6's 575 lumens, incandescent-matching 2700K color, 90 CRI with Cree's TrueWhite technology, 35,000 hour life, 3 year warranty from HD, integral white recessed trim and diffuser, instant on, and dimmability (not specified how low, but the CR6 dims all the way down to 5%). As with the CR6, it has a standard Edison base, but a GU24 version is available for those on the left coast.

    This definitely not a clone of the LR4 - it's a new design with three rotating clips to hold it into place, though the clips are much smaller and less obtrusive than on the CR6. The trim is 4 7/8" diameter, and the internals are just under 3" wide and designed to install in "most standard and shallow 4 in. cans". The Energy Star site (at ) shows Cree's published specifications to be conservative, with the government's tests showing both the 4" and 6" downlights producing at least 585 lumens from only 9.1 watts. If there's any downer, it's that there's more glare than with the CR6, a natural result given that the same brightness of light is emanating from a smaller area (about 2 1/2" diameter) and it's also less deeply recessed than in the CR6 (about 1" rather than 2"). And perhaps because it's still new, it sells for $50 at HD whilst the CR6's price has dropped to $40 (both may be priced lower if your locale has incentives in places). Still, it's the best looking 4" LED module I've yet seen.

    HD has a cheaper 4" LED module sold under their Commercial Electric brand, but it's 3000K and lower CRI and looks a bit cold compared to incandescent/halogen downlights, although they have the advantage of being usuable in wet locations and have a nice-looking anodyzed brushed nickel as well as white finishes available.


    clipped on: 11.26.2011 at 01:00 pm    last updated on: 11.26.2011 at 01:01 pm

    RE: Recessed lights in kitchen: black or white baffle trim? (Follow-Up #12)

    posted by: mamadadapaige on 05.19.2009 at 06:58 am in Kitchens Forum

    I just finished up a kitchen lighting course and was advised to choose clear specular or Alzak. others above mentioned this too... would probably be a good way to go.


    clipped on: 11.02.2011 at 09:29 am    last updated on: 11.02.2011 at 09:29 am

    RE: put me out of my misery and just tell me what kind of cans to (Follow-Up #1)

    posted by: beekeeperswife on 02.15.2010 at 05:40 pm in Kitchens Forum

    Oh, recessed lights, that was a nightmarish decision. We ended up picking Halo, but don't. There is nothing wrong with them, mind you, but I wanted Halo with the Alzak Wheat Haze trim. Juno makes that trim. The Alzak Wheat trim kit is what makes them "disappear" into the ceiling.

    Go to the lighting store (not Lowe's or HD) and look at them.

    So I would suggest Juno, with the Alzak wheat haze trim.

    My 2 cents.


    clipped on: 11.02.2011 at 09:21 am    last updated on: 11.02.2011 at 09:21 am

    RE: How to clean marble floors - what PH Neutral cleaner? (Follow-Up #6)

    posted by: jacqueline5 on 09.10.2010 at 03:20 am in Bathrooms Forum

    I think I got the recipe I use from this web site five years ago when we completed our house. I use a homemade mixture of 1/2 Purified water (we have a reverse osmosis), 1/2 Isopropyl alcohol 90%, and a couple of drops of Dawn Dish soap. I mix it into a spray bottle, spray on, wipe off. Grungy areas I let it sit for a minute and scrub with a white scrubby sponge. I use it on my granite in the kitchen (Azul Bahia - kind of delicate and fussy), the Uba Tuba granite around the fireplace and hearth, and on the marble in my master bath floors, shower walls, and counters.


    clipped on: 10.11.2011 at 11:25 am    last updated on: 10.11.2011 at 11:46 am

    RE: Under cabinet LED lighting (Follow-Up #7)

    posted by: seaduck on 09.09.2011 at 11:11 pm in Kitchens Forum

    Environmental Lights sells MaxLites, which are dimmable and do not require transformers. Get the warm white 2700K version, and the model with 33 LEDs / foot.

    Fabulous! Our electrician loved them...a breeze to install. They look great and are very bright. I don't dim them cuz of the way I work, but could and might for "mood." Environmental Lights is terrific...great service. You can buy a sample with a cord to plug in to see how they look.

    Re the dimmer The EL website tells you what they recommend. It's a pretty standard just need to get the one the recommend. You can buy them from EL; our electrician provided them. But if you have questions, just call EL...they are very helpful.

    I've posted a similar message in another thread and will probably bore you all silly by doing it again in the future. But we could not be happier. I spent a lot of time looking at LEDs.


    clipped on: 09.09.2011 at 11:42 pm    last updated on: 09.09.2011 at 11:42 pm

    RE: Finished Traditional Kitchen (lots of pics) (Follow-Up #41)

    posted by: jm_seattle on 03.06.2011 at 12:35 am in Kitchens Forum

    Thanks all! We really did our best to build a 50-year kitchen instead of one that would get ripped out in 10 or 20 years. That goal involved always pushing for three things: high quality, high utility, and a traditional look that fit in with the rest of the house rather than the current trends. Here are a few more details and answers to the questions:

    The house is a 1924 Tudor. Not very big by today's standards (<2K sq ft), but had a kitchen and breakfast room that we could remodel into a single kitchen without adding on. The total space is about 16' x 12'. Here's the rough floorplan we worked from:

    Highly recommended if you're in the Seattle area! In addition to making beautiful, high quality cabinets, it was Tim who came up with a lot of the cool storage ideas like taking advantage of the interior walls.

    Compost Bin: Blanco Solon.
    It's out of Canada but there are US .com vendors if you do a web search.

    Tile: Oregon Tile & Marble's Isole line. They have a showroom in Seattle, but also sell through retail tile stores. &

    Here's a closeup of the backsplash:

    Hardware is all in polished nickel (except the glass filler, which was the only one we could find that didn't require two hands and was only available in chrome).

    Cabinet latches:
    We chose ones with large knobs on the advice of our cabinet maker (who said as we got older our hands might have a harder time turning a smaller knob).

    Drawer pulls (incl fridge) are Restoration Hardware Aubrey:

    Hinges are White Chapel Ball-tip:

    Cabinets/trim are Benjamin Moore Bavarian Cream
    Walls are C2 Sugar Cookie
    Ceiling Benjamin Moore Paper Mache

    Counter: Some sort of Brazilian Soapstone. I wouldn't recommend our fabricator. If you're shopping for soapstone, definitely bring a water bottle / damp cloth with you and view each piece wet. Ours was light grey when we bought it, but turned almost jet black when we oiled it with mineral oil, and the damp cloth gave us a much better idea of the final color.

    Sink: Franke GNX-110-28.
    This was one of the few sinks we could find with a drain in the corner. The corner drain allows the plumbing to be tucked away in a corner and gives you much more usable space under the sink. Here's a shot of the sink and the usable space underneath:

    DISHWASHER: Miele G 2183 SCVi
    REFRIGERATOR: Sub-Zero 700TCi LH
    HOOD: Vent-a-Hood SLH9-130SS
    MAIN OVEN: Miele H4780BPSS
    STEAM OVEN: Miele DG4080SS
    COOKTOP: Miele KM5753+

    Just let me know if you have other questions- I'm happy to tell the good and bad and it's the least I can do after all the help this forum has given me. :)


    clipped on: 03.06.2011 at 06:52 am    last updated on: 03.06.2011 at 06:52 am

    Finished period kitchen - 1925 Craftsman Bungalow

    posted by: tito on 12.02.2007 at 11:25 pm in Kitchens Forum

    I am thrilled to finally be able to post photos of our finished kitchen. Most of the work was done last December and January, but it took until September to get around to installing the backsplash. Id have posted sooner, but about a week after the backsplash was finished, we made an offer on a new house so Ive been busy dealing with the buying/selling/moving process. Were heartbroken to be leaving our new kitchen (and our house in general), but Im planning to recreate much of it in our new house which was built in 1921.

    Here are a few before pics:

    Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket

    Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket

    Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket

    Heres what the kitchen looks like now:

    Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket

    Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket

    We tried to be true to the period of the house (1925 craftsman bungalow) without being rigid about it. In our effort to make the kitchen somewhat authentic, we kept the original floors, light shades, and built-in ironing board. We also chose inset cabinets and polished nickel hardware. No one would mistake it for the original kitchen, but it does feel like it belongs. We couldnt have done it without help from countless posters on this forum. Thanks for all the help.

    Here are the details on the new kitchen:

    Floors refinished original fir
    Cabinets Brookhaven Louisburg
    Cabinet latches Crown Hardware (polished nickel)
    Countertops Soapstone
    Backsplash Subway Ceramics
    Faucet Cifial Highlands Wall-Mount (polished nickel)
    Sink Rohl Fireclay single bowl
    Light fixtures Original shades in new fixtures from Rejuvenation
    Undercabinet lighting Pegasus xenon pucks
    Paint Benjamin Moore Weston Flax


    Dishwasher - Bosch Integrated 4 cycle SHV46-C13UC
    Range - Bosch Integra Pro Electric Range HEI7282
    Range Hood - Zephyr Hurricane
    Refrigerator - Fisher & Paykel E522B


    clipped on: 01.01.2011 at 01:47 pm    last updated on: 01.01.2011 at 02:04 pm

    RE: wall color (Follow-Up #4)

    posted by: boxerpups on 12.31.2010 at 01:51 pm in Kitchens Forum

    Oh and wall color, I forgot you were trying to decide on
    wall color too.

    Again narrow down the color of the cabs & island. Then post
    an image and I can help you with some specific ideas.
    Ellen Kennon Edgewood Green Walls

    creamy cabs with a dark green ubatuba like granite

    Well seasoned style idea blog

    Goldenstraw by Benjamin Moore is a soft creamy yellow
    based paint that looks lovely with the flecs in the
    Verde Butterfly

    Rich Cream Benjamin Moore another soft creamy color
    with an undertone of yellow especially next to green/blk

    Naples cream
    A beautiful color but I am not sure if it will look
    great with dark blk like green and cream cabs..


    clipped on: 12.31.2010 at 02:11 pm    last updated on: 12.31.2010 at 02:12 pm

    RE: Bracing's my kitchen layout. (Follow-Up #57)

    posted by: davidro1 on 08.13.2010 at 11:09 pm in Kitchens Forum

    An ideal kitchen,
    not over the top,
    has at least this
    (in my view).

    delete "uppers" on the wall, because you have enough storage volume in drawers,
    and you can add some of them back in later to make proportions right, and to add interest or accents.

    made of
    coffee silgranite,
    anthracite silgranite,
    enameled cast iron.
    not stainless (some people have been known to rub them all the time like they were the barrels of their weapon of choice)
    Not biscuit silgranite (shows smudges long after it's basically clean).

    If one sink
    with multiples sources of water.
    No need to let a single faucet be the bottleneck spot.

    an IHW
    a filtered water tap
    a chiller (not in the fridge)
    a faucet that mixes regular "mains" water (hot and cold lines)
    another mixer valve for a hose and spray "wand" with toggle

    Two fridges,
    one being near the sink nearest the cooktop; this could be drawers under counter.
    one being where "other people" will go get things and not disturb the cook or the flow.
    Preferably one is passive cooling (nothing dries out there; good for cheeses and organics)

    Say "no" to side by side fridge/freezers.
    The space always feels tight.
    The space is always narrow.

    a dishwasher drawer,
    an 18" or 24" full height dishwasher

    in the basement:
    a chest freezer
    (passive cooling, not frost-free: no freezer burn)

    Drawers as "deep" to back wall as possible. E.g. Tandembox 650mm length
    This dimension is distance to back wall, not the height of drawer.
    And counters 29" or 30".

    All Drawers, everywhere, even under the sink.
    Wide drawers.

    Lots of HVAC appropriately planned long in advance.
    A big canopy for the extraction fan.
    Lots of MUA for when the fan is on "high".


    Spider, here are notes i've made, in terms of what is most maintenance-free.
    This might be good to have on hand when discussing with DH your SO.

    shows smudges least / most
    makes clean happen / the opposite
    looks neat not messy / the opposite
    looks OK even if dirty / looks still dirty when it's basically clean
    easy to clean, and time is little / hard or takes time


    / is used to separate categories
    , commas, are to keep a number of things, in the same category

    Here we go.

    counter clutter: slim vase for an eye target flower, glass bowl with fruit / with toaster oven, coffee maker, coffee grinder, salt / with canisters and mixer
    faucet: laminar flow (cause splashes) / aerated flow and strong / aerated flow shaped to reduce splashback
    configuration: sink and cooktop on same counter / on separate counters (sweep floor more often)
    faucet mounting: wall / on counter / on counter with escutcheon (ring around faucet base) or wide plate
    faucet finish: brushed / matt smooth / smooth and shiny / shiny chrome (polished chrome)
    floor color: beige, mottled, marbled / medium, dark / creamy, off-white / white
    floor material: laminate, marmoleum, linoleum, vinyl / wood / tile
    appliance finishes in general: black mottled / bisque mottled / white mottled / brushed / smooth
    brushed stainless finish: this is hard to describe with an appropriate adjective, but go touch high price appliances and notice how they don't show finger marks!
    paint finish in low grease areas: matt / semi-gloss, pearl / high gloss
    paint finish in high grease areas: semi-gloss, pearl / high gloss / matt
    backsplash: rough surface tile (stone) / brushed stainless / matt or mottled glass, smooth tile / shiny tile / shiny glass / mirror
    backsplash tile pattern: square / running bond (alternating; doesn't align grout lines)
    grout: unsealed / sealed / epoxy
    walls and "upper" cabinet fronts: solid / glass front cabinets / open shelving and open storage
    cabinet fronts: slab / shaker / panels and beading / fluted or other detailed woodwork
    vent hood type: recirculating with charcoal filter / exhausts outside and noisy / same and silent at lower speeds
    vent hood material: steel / glass
    vent hood fan: propellor blades / squirrel cage / same and powerful and with make-up air provided in whole house HVAC
    microwave: no turntable / with turntable
    electric cooktop : radiant / induction
    electric cooktop color: white / black
    oven: hidden coils / exposed coils
    gas cooktop: sealed burners / open burners
    countertop positioning: overhangs forward over the drawer fronts (no drips on them) / cut to be flush (drips go on the drawer fronts and dribble from there)
    countertop make: factory-made quartz / soapstone (hard, not soft) / slate, granite, quartzite / wood / marble / limestone, travertine
    sink: brushed stainless, ceramic, enameled cast, dark color silgranite / flat finish stainless, light color silgranite
    sink mounting: mounted from underneath with counter on top / mounted from above so sink rim sits on top of counter
    light placement: several sources and types of light, dimmable / a row of lights over the counter / one central light (never makes good shadows), or washing light down a mediocre wall (shows wall off, but only good if wall is good)
    suspended lighting: pendants that one can clip off and put in the dishwasher / pendants easy to wipe down / ornate
    embedded light: tube fluorescent, LED's / embedded incandescent (xenon, halogen) / puck add-ons

    storage (pantry) somewhere removed from the cooking and cleaning action triangle / storage close to or inside the action triangle / no pantry, storage mixed up everywhere
    two clear counter areas at least 36" each / one counter area clear for at least 48" / small pieces of counter interrupted by sink, cooktop, ends
    a central or isolated triangle, with small fridge (for the cook) / a central triangle with the only fridge / a triangle mixed up with pantry and prep zones
    sink and cooktop have elbow room on both sides / sink and cooktop have no counter on one side

    main aisle:
    for one person or two who know how to get along well:
    41"-44" aisle / three inches more or less than this / 35"-37" aisle / aisle 49" or wider (too many steps)
    for three or more, or for two who are not well coordinated:
    add 3 inches to the above numbers
    (of course this all assumes that one likes a small triangle for the cook)

    with straight runs that end at the wall / with corner cabinets wrapping around a corner

    Some of these notes above might not be spot on.
    I'm not a KD.
    I've hired them, and hired bathroom designers and cabinet designers too.
    Everyone has their own opinions.
    None ever satisfied me, because I'm unusual in several ways, and I think they used that to pump fees (for conversations and proposals) instead of working with me.
    I got along great with most of the tradesmen.
    I learned a lot about plumbing and tile setting when I remodeled bathrooms.
    I learned it on the web and from the trades.

    I figured I would focus more on what kitchen renovators might know that I didn't know, and that is how I ended up here.



    clipped on: 08.15.2010 at 09:42 pm    last updated on: 08.15.2010 at 09:42 pm

    My kitchen is done!

    posted by: jgarner53 on 05.29.2007 at 01:10 pm in Kitchens Forum

    Just moving the link to my kitchen photos over from the discussions section.

    These are the specs:
    Cabinets: custom flush inset by local shop
    Paint: cabinets - BM Mayonnaise (also on ceiling & trim)
    walls - BM Potpourri Green
    Stove: DCS 36" 6-burner all-gas range with low backguard (required by my local code)
    Hood: Vent-a-Hood Excalibur, 36" in Biscuit
    Fridge: Amana 36" cabinet-depth top-mount
    Dishwasher: Bosch Integra SHX57C03UC with custom panel
    Sink: Franke fireclay sink, 28 inches
    Faucet: Chicago faucet wall-mount in polished nickel
    Soap dispenser: Rohl Perrin & Rowe LS850P (with NeverMT)
    Airswitch: Franke, in black
    Drawer handles/Door knobs: House of Antique Hardware black glass hexagonal knobs & bridge pulls
    Countertop: Belvedere soapstone from M. Teixeira in San Francisco
    Tile: Subway Ceramics 3x6 subway tile, Daltile black liner & 3/4" round, green liner "dots" from B&W tile in Riverside, CA
    Floor: Marmoleum in Butter with Coffee accent strip
    Light fixtures: Skidmore pendants and Jefferson ceiling fixture, from Rejuvenation
    Undercabinet lights: LEDs from LEDtronics
    Outlet covers, pushbutton switches and switchplate: House of Antique Hardware

    Glass for new window and cabinet doors: salvaged wavy glass

    Here is a link that might be useful: Jgarner53's kitchen


    clipped on: 07.29.2010 at 10:01 am    last updated on: 07.29.2010 at 10:01 am

    RE: Anyone tired of their white subway tile backsplash yet? (Follow-Up #9)

    posted by: chana_goanna on 07.27.2010 at 03:06 pm in Kitchens Forum


    1. When will you be posting your comleted pics? I can't WAIT to see your kitchen. (Or did I miss it somehow?)

    2. Please post a link to your blog; our tastes seem very similar and I'm sure your blog would be a goldmine of ideas for me.

    Gina: I personally find subway tile much more interesting with a darker grout, like so:

    The trick here is to space the tiles very close together and use a medium-to-dark gray grout, not black, which would be too stark a contrast.


    clipped on: 07.28.2010 at 02:27 pm    last updated on: 07.28.2010 at 02:27 pm

    Some missing threads

    posted by: buehl on 03.22.2010 at 12:50 am in Kitchens Forum

    I was able to rescue the URLs for a few threads. HOWEVER, even if you post to them, they will not appear in the list. I tried to bump the current "Read Me" thread and it did not appear with the 5 now on the page. So, if you post to one of the rescued threads, know that others will be able to see it if they link to it but it won't appear on the thread list, at least not right now.

    To use the URLs below, copy & paste the URL into the "Address" box of your browser.

    I'm not sure if this will last long, but here are some of the missing threads:

    • Designer faucets -- are they better quality? -
      Posted by: sayde on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 20:55

    • How Long did your kitchen remodel take? -
      Posted by: sabjimata on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 18:16

    • Finished farm kitchen -
      Posted by: pinch_me on Thu, Mar 18, 10 at 21:57

    • opinion on granite choice needed please! -
      Posted by: heather720 on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 12:27

    • dark or light? -
      Posted by: lola77 on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 18:16

    • 99% Finished Cherry Kitchen (Before and After) -
      Posted by: 8 on Thu, Dec 10, 09 at 14:36

    • The Intimidation Issue -
      Posted by: warmfridge on Sat, Mar 20, 10 at 19:58

    • What do you love best about your kitchen -
      Posted by: danielle84 on Sat, Mar 20, 10 at 0:06

    • Granite yard/fabricators recs in NJ -
      Posted by: roxy2007 on Sat, Mar 20, 10 at 17:37

    • substitute for this walker zanger tile? -
      Posted by: november on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 10:41

    • Knobs vs Handles -
      Posted by: ladypie on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 0:30

    • granite fabrication questions..what do you think! -
      Posted by: rubyvine on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 19:29

    • Thoughts on choice of granite -
      Posted by: motleydog on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 15:39

    • hello! some first questions... -
      Posted by: thndersnow on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 17:16

    • Getting new counters after 25 years -
      Posted by: dee4nebraska on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 19:19

    • Honed granite reviews??? -
      Posted by: aswierk on Sat, Mar 20, 10 at 16:00

    • mystery granite--more photos, please help identify if you can -
      Posted by: chipongo on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 2:39

    • Granite is in! Please, please help now with backsplash -
      Posted by: tbosshar on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 10:46

    • Sealers modify color of granite??? -
      Posted by: danielle84 on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 12:04

    • Is it me that's nutty or is it my designer? -
      Posted by: lissbell on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 1:38

    • Good grief : sinks, pots and induction cooktops -
      Posted by: sochi on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 18:34

    • Island Granite in--White Quartz pics! -
      Posted by: firsthouse_mp on Sat, Mar 20, 10 at 1:50

    • 12'' or 14'' deep cabinets? 15'' -
      Posted by: sherriz on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 2:00

    • Would love some opinions on my kitchen plan -
      Posted by: periwinkle18 on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 15:42

    • kitchen faucets -
      Posted by: nimela on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 16:42

    • I love my sink!! -
      Posted by: plllog on Tue, Mar 16, 10 at 21:39

    • Recessed cans 12 or 18 inches from cabinets? -
      Posted by: tartan22 on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 10:09

    • Planning my Kitchen Renovation - Tile layout in North Vancouver -
      Posted by: johnfrwhipple on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 13:34

    • What light bulbs do you use for your island pendantsi -
      Posted by: joep_2009 on Sun, Mar 21, 10 at 11:20


    clipped on: 03.22.2010 at 06:11 am    last updated on: 03.22.2010 at 06:11 am

    RE: sewer gas smell coming from drain in basement (Follow-Up #1)

    posted by: aidan_m on 07.16.2008 at 11:12 am in Plumbing Forum

    Your trap is dry. The forced air causes the water to dry rapidly because of the pressure imbalance. This is a common problem in commercial building lavatories where the exhaust fan runs constantly. A solution is to add a fresh air intake vent in a basement window to balance the pressure. Another solution is to completely seal off the basement from the climate controlled zone of the house, but it sounds like your basement is part of the conditioned space of the home (most likely through the old floor boards). A third solution is to put water down the floor drain every day.

    The hole you see in the side of the floor drain is probably a tee that runs to your foundation drain system.


    clipped on: 03.03.2010 at 09:25 am    last updated on: 03.03.2010 at 09:25 am

    RE: HELP!! I can't make paint color decision! (Follow-Up #65)

    posted by: trinkette on 02.25.2010 at 12:08 pm in Kitchens Forum

    I've just quickly scanned this thread and I'm on the way out the door. However, I wanted to say that I live in VA (country) and I am renting a home while mine is being marketed for sale. Renting has afforded me time to use the rental house (just down the road from my property) as a F&B playground, so to speak.

    Clunch, Old White and Off White work really well together and currently they are my favorite picks for the interior of my house to-be-built. Someone asked about Clunch... It is neutral and very versatile. I sleep in it every night; I tried it on the walls AND trim and I've never grown tired of it. Very mutable color. Sometimes it is so lovely, I could EAT it! Think of a pale, subtle, cafe au lait. Looks gorgeous with dark mahogany wood (as well as other more orangey wood colors like maple), pale Robin's Egg blue/green, and antiqued gold. You can stand in a room with it and all four walls look different as they pick up reflected light from different sources and objects.

    Also, Off White is exquisite. It was used in a show house recently and I recognized it the minute I saw it (and I did not know they had used F&B paints until I saw them on the walls). It says a lot for a paint color when you can walk into a house and recognize it. This color is simply dazzling. Off White changes with the light and can have a beautiful greenish/grey (think lambs ears) element that comes through at times. Very, VERY subtle and extremely versatile color. I plan to try more of it.

    For me, in addition to being deeper in hue, Old white is a little warmer than Off White. I think there is plenty of contrast, ESPECIALLY if one color is trim and the other wall. If you like it, for something a little greener/greyer, look at French Grey as well.

    I'd say that Lime White is another color that carries tones similar to those this group.

    Also, compared to the group above, White Tie appears warmer with more of a yellow base (my husband loves it) and is wonderful combined with Pointing which is absolutely beautiful, but, perhaps more "modern" and cleaner than the Old W, Off W, and Clunch. White Tie is gorgeous with traditional and antique wood furnishings.

    I have had ALL of these on the walls here.

    I've tried more that you've mentioned, including the light blues (which would look lovely with Off White)... however, I'm late and I've got to run for now. Sounds like a wonderful project ahead!


    clipped on: 02.25.2010 at 06:27 pm    last updated on: 02.25.2010 at 06:27 pm

    RE: Expensive kitchens looking dated.... (Follow-Up #70)

    posted by: barthelemy on 11.26.2009 at 04:29 pm in Kitchens Forum

    I am French and live in France (in Parisian 'suburbia' ...)

    Reguarding the debate about traditional/repro kitchen in Europe ...

    Altough I do not pretend to sum up the feelings of 350,000,000 Europeans, my feeling is that if traditional kitchens do exist here, their market share is tiny.

    From what I've seen, traditional kitchens are used only at both ends of the market spectrum : either in working-class tract houses or upper-class country houses (Marie-Antoinette @ Le Petit Trianon syndrome).

    I live in a new masterplanned community, and although the architecture of the complex itself is traditional (reproduction of 19th/18th centuries French houses/buildings), all my neighbours have contemporary kitchens, even the ones who favored traditional furniture to decorate their home.

    Furthermore, what would qualify as "traditionnal" for my French eye would certainly be seen as transitional on this forum. A doorstyle like Adel white/birch from Ikea is seen as pretty traditionnal here, I do believe that anything more traditional and ornate than a painted Shaker door would qualify as "kitsch" for most people I know here.

    "Hardcore" traditional kitchens, with a lot of carvings, moldings, staggered upper cabinets, are unseen here and look very strange for me.

    But I believe that the main difference between American and European kitchens is that we prefer to mix and match rather than reproducing one style. For instance, I often see people on this forum wondering if they can mix different finishes for their hardware, light fixtures and plumbing fixtures, whereas from a European point of view, mixing styles and finishes is the way to go (putting a chandelier in a modern kitchen or a 1970s pendant in a traditional kitchen).


    clipped on: 11.26.2009 at 07:03 pm    last updated on: 11.26.2009 at 07:03 pm