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RE: Help with Appliance Selection- Induction Range/CD Fridge (Follow-Up #17)

posted by: JWVideo on 10.19.2012 at 01:29 pm in Appliances Forum

>>>"Now if only I could figure out with induction range I want!!!"<<<

Because of what you said about a CD fridge, I am assuming that you have somewhat limited space in your kitchen and that is why you are looking at a range. (If you had a large enough space and the available electrical capacity, I would suggest considering a separate oven and cooktop. But, it is hard enough sorting out ranges, let alone adding even more choices.)

I recently went through the mill of selecting a new stove. My old stove, a ten-year old GE dual fuel had to be replaced when it controller board died. From my research, I can offer the following info for you.

KENMORE:

The more expensive Kenmore induction ranges are rebadged Electrolux units. The not-quite-so-expensive ones are made by Samsung. The least expensive Kenmore induction range was a rebadged Samsung FTQ707NW, a model that Samsung has discontinued in its own product line. The Kenmore version was still on offer at my local Sears when I was last in there during Labor Day weekend. It may have been discontinued since then. Reviews are mixed and some early adopters ran into circuit board and other component failures. There are some postings here on the Kenmore models, but I do not recall many of them.

WHIRLPOOL (INCLUDING MAYTAG AND KITCHENAID)

The Maytag and Whirlpool models have their larger burners at the rear of the cooktop with a cooktop control panel in front between the two smaller burners. I find this inconvenient but somebody with small children might see this as a safety feature. Because the burners are in the back near the thick backsplash, there will be limits on pan sizes. (I don't think you could could fit a canning kettle or similar large stockpot, if you do that kind of thing.) I have a personal prejudice against control surfaces being on induction cooktops because of experience with with the previous generation of induction stoves (from a couple of decades ago). They had problems with spills on the cooktops. A lot of folks now seem to prefer cooktop surface controls, however, and the old problems may have been rectified.

Both the Maytag and WP models have convection ovens and offer a lower-temp self-cleaning feature as well as a standard self-clean cycle. Basically, you pour 16 oz. of water on the bottom of the oven (you can do this because of the hidden baking element). You close the door and run a self clean cycle for 40 minutes. Then you wipe out the oven. So far, reviewers were not impressed with the lower temp self-cleaning feature.

I see that the Maytag and Whirlpool induction ranges are now being sold through Costco. Becuase of Costco's longstanding "satisfaction guaranteed" and "no questions return" policies, this can be a good thing if you get lemon.

THe WP and MAytag models claim to have 6.2 cu. ft. ovens. I am not sure how they actually measure that capcity and cannot say if those ovens's usable capacities are actually any larger than the 5.9 cu. ft. that Samsung claims or the 5.2 cu. ft. that GE claims.

Whirlpool also markets a different induction stove under the Kitchenaid brand. The dearth of information on this new model has been discussed in earlier posts here.

SAMSUNG

Samsung used to offer the FTQ307 which was the least expensive (in the US) induction stove and which had (to me) a peculiar burner layout with controls on the cooktop. Early models had problems with a noisy cooling fan but that apparently was fixed on later production. There is a relatively recent thread on this model, started by somebody who got an amazing deal on a close-out floor model. (Northcarolina is the screen name that I recall for that thread.)

The FTQ307 has been superceded by two new models, the NE595 and NE 597. These have been available in Canada for about a year but were only released in the US a couple of months ago.

These have more conventional burner and control layouts than the FTQ. The NE595 is a basic model with a more conventional burner layout and all controls on the backsplash. During holiday sales, at least, it can be the least expensive induction range in the US. It was down around $1250 at Best Buy over Labor Day weekend. The front right burner is a 12-inch diameter burner which seems as though it could handle very large stockpots and canning kettles but which (I've read) may not work with pans smaller than 8-inches in diameter. It has a a third element "true" convection system with multiple fans.

The Samsung NE697 adds more features (such as warming drawer) and an interesting burner layout with more power. The right side burners are an 11-inch diameter burner in front with 6-inch diameter burner burner in the back, in front of the usual free-standing stove's backsplash. On the left are two square burners, each nine-inches on a side. They can be operated together as one very large burner (for griddles and and stockpots) or as two separate nine-inch burners. When operated together, both of the square burners can provide boost power.

The Samsung stoves have some oddities, such as an oven preset for chicken nuggets. The also have a 120v electrical outlet on the top panel, which is something that used to be common on electric stoves but is not seen so much any more.

Because of my budget and because it was readily available (important because my old stove had died), I looked pretty hard at the Samsung NE597. The things I found particularly attractive were the oven features and that the cooktop layout seemed to offer a lot of flexibility.

I have read, but have no first hand knowledge, that Samsung induction burners can be fussy about centering pans and pan coverage of the induction burners. I started a thread on the question but nobody had enough first hand experience to say how fussy the new units' burners are.

Both Samsung models have hidden bake elements and offer a "steam clean" self-cleaning function. It works like the Whirlpool steam cleaning described above except that it calls for less water (10 oz. instead of 16) and less time (20 minutes versus 40).

When I was looking a couple of months ago, I had to go to Samsung's Canadian website to find the manuals for these stoves, but that may have changed now. Also, back then, the stoves were only carried in the US by Best Buy, but they now seem on offer from others such as PC Richards.

One of the nice touches in the manuals for the Samsung stoves is that they have explicit and clear tables explaining how burners are linked and how power settings on on one burner affect the other linked burner. (Basically, the only time one burner's setting affects the other is when you want to run the other in boost mode.)

ELECTROLUX (& FRIGIDAIRE)

For several years, Electrolux has offered a freestanding and a slide-in range. I have not seen the free-standing on offer recently but the slide-in has received considerable and mostly favorable discussion here. Both Avidchef and Chac-mool, who posted above, have the slide-in. Both have posted in many of those threads with useful information.

The slide-in seems to be available for around for $3200 although I have seen sites that advertise it at as much as $3600. If you need or want side-panels or a vent-riser/backsplash (basically converting the slide-in to a freestanding version), stainless-steel side panels cost about $130 each and the backguard is about $100.

My recollection is that both Electrolux stoves claimed to have 4.2 cu. ft. oven capacity. It seemed fully as large as the 5 cut. ft. capacity of my old stove and plenty large enough for even a 20# turkey. Other makers claim larger capacities which may matter to some people.

The slide in has a good burner and control layout, very good convection functions in the oven, and a second oven in what would otherwise be a warming drawer. I am not sure if the the bottom oven runs on 240v or 120v current. (A 120v oven would be like a countertop appliance, useful but not quite a full-fledged second oven.) Chac_mool or Avidchef can answer that for you.

The E-lux slide in seems to be one of the induction models favored here at GW.

What used to be the Electrolux free-standing is still on offer from Sears as a Kenmore (for roughly $2400-$2600) and a somewhat revamped version now seems to be offered by Electrolux's Frigidaire division (in the "Frigidaire Professional" line) for roughly $2k at AJ Madison and others. Near as I can tell, the main difference in the current Frigidaire free-standing induction stove is that the oven capacity is now claimed to be 6 cu. ft. rather than 4.5 cu. feet claimed previously. I guess they made the warming drawer smaller.

User reviews on the Kenmore and old Electrolux freestanding have been mixed due to some cricuit-board and controller problems with some of the early production.

Frigidaire also offers a slide-in "hybrid" meaning that it has two 1.8 kwh induction burners and three standard radiant burners. I recall that GW had a thread discussing hybrids which should turn up in a search. This unit seems to go for around $2500.

CR's reliability surveys do not have a report for Electrolux electric stoves and put Fridgidaire at about mid-range with a 10% defect rate. There is no separate listing for the induction stoves. Several people, mostly early adopters, have reported failures of controller boards and Electrolux has apparently bought back a couple of slide-ins with multiple board failures. CR downrated the Electrolux slide-in apparently on the basis of the relatively high price and middling baking performance. As far as I can tell, CR does not use convection features when measuring baking performance. One of the tests evenness while baking (multiple racks of sugar cookies) seems to be the very kind of thing at which convection excels. Reports here indicate that the convection function works very well. So, I would discount CR's rating on the baking functions.

GENERAL ELECTRIC

GE offers two induction models in its "Profile" line: a slide-in (price ranges from $2450 to $2850) and a free-standing induction stove (price ranging from $2150 to $2500).

Both models have swoopy styling that some people like and others do not. Both models have black side panels, much as is the case with the Samsungs, the Kenmores, the Maytag (and I believe the Whirlpool and KA models.) This means that the GE slide-in can function as a freestanding model. GE does not specifically offer a back-guard/vent for the slide ind. I've been told that the $200 backguard/vent-riser for the GE Cafe stoves will fit but have no confirmation of that.

Pretty much everybody --- at least everybody who likes induction stoves --- agrees that the GE stoves are excellent products.

The free-standing model is CR's highest rated stove. The slide is is very similar except for the relocation of the control panel to the front and the elimination of the rear vent-riser backsplash. GE told me that you can bridge burners with griddles and grill pans. They also told me that the cooktop will work with large stockpots and canning kettles. They volunteered that they recommend against deep-fat frying in very large pots because of the weight and heat. (I don't know about you, but it had not occurred to me that, in my home kitchen, I might want to fry chicken in 20 quarts of oil. Apparently, somebody before me asked about that.)

Again, there are numbers of threads here about the GE induction ranges which can give you fairly detailed information so there is no need for me to repeat it here.

As with all of the current models, long-term durability is an unknown. CR does not break out reliability data specifically on GE induction stoves. FWIW, the CR surveys show GE and its Hotpoint sub-brand have the smallest problem rate with electric stoves, about 5%.

The only problems reported by GW users so far indicate that several folks had problems with the large burner malfunctioning on slide-in models purchased in April and May of this year. You will see discussion of this in the long thread on the GE slide in. GE apparently is covering those problems under warranty.

The other problem that I am aware of with the GEs is that the user manual is a generic one for smoothtop electric stoves. It barely even mentions that GE sells induction stoves. In contrast, Samsung and Electrolux have model specific manuals which seemed pretty useful to me when I downloaded them.

VIKING

The Viking is the only other induction stove that is readily available in the US. There is a long thread on this model. It was started by luv2putt last spring when his Viking was delivered. Search for "racing red induction" to find the thread.

The Viking apparently works very well. It has a good burner layout with spacing wide enough to be able to run 4 large pots at once (something I find useful, but YMMV). It is the only domestically available model with knob controls. It also is the only domestically available induction stove that can be had in colors. (For example, as name of his thread says, Luv2putt got his stove in a bright, flaming red.) Luv2utt and several others report that their stoves have been excellent and reliable. This indicates that that Viking may have -- at least for this product --- turned the corer on its quality control problems which put it par with reputations of the makers of high-end Italian sports cars.

I looked at the stove and immediately thought, I want one! However, the stove weighs nearly 500 pounds. It costs nearly $7k. (The price is even higher if you want a finish other than stainless, white or black). Viking's manual is pretty good but contains a number of idiotic weasely statements and warnings inserted by folks who obviously knew nothing about induction. Those things raise flags about the efficacy of service and support should they be needed. In short, those concerns and the absurd, budget-busting, trophy-stove price put the Viking induction stove out of the question for me. YMMV.

SUMMARY:

My personal take on all of this is that the stove I would pick depends on the budget but, once I decided on budget, I would be looking at a variety of stoves, some induction and some not. I would pick the stove which was within my budget and which had the mix of features and trade-offs that I liked the best. (In my case, my old stove died and I had to get something right away. A gas stove just barely nosed out the Samsung NE597 on the day I had to choose. YMWV.)

Hope this helps with sorting through your choices on induction ranges.

NOTES:

great rundown on induction ranges
clipped on: 10.26.2012 at 05:04 pm    last updated on: 10.26.2012 at 05:07 pm

RE: Pool area garden: roses and clemmies ...please post your pret (Follow-Up #2)

posted by: oakleyok on 04.21.2011 at 01:32 pm in Home Decorating Forum

I don't have a pool but I'm going to play anyway!

These are from last year. Right now everything is budding out and the roses and such are going to be spectacular!

My Peach Rose. Right now it has about a 100 buds on it!

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Carpet Roses

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Moon Flowers

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Globe Amaranth

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clipped on: 04.23.2011 at 02:05 pm    last updated on: 04.23.2011 at 02:05 pm

RE: best websites to buy faucets, showers, sinks & med cabinets f (Follow-Up #7)

posted by: skeetie219 on 03.14.2011 at 08:59 am in Bathrooms Forum

I'm looking for faucets/fixtures as well so thanks for information. BTW, check out ebates.com or mr.rebate.com so you can get additional cash back if you purhcase from one of their vendors. Dealyard.com offers a 5% cash rebate if you use mr.rebate.com. HTH

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clipped on: 03.15.2011 at 07:56 pm    last updated on: 03.15.2011 at 07:56 pm

$3k budget 'elegant' bathroom renovation done!

posted by: staceyneil on 02.02.2011 at 10:24 am in Home Decorating Forum

Hi all-
I just posted this over on the bathrooms forum, where I was spending a lot of time in the last year... but thought some of you also might like to see it.
We just finished a totally DIY re-do of my teen daughter's bathroom.
It involved gutting the room to the studs and joists and re-doing everything. She had a lot of design input, and we used a lot of salvaged, yardsale, Craigslist and eBay scores, including an old dresser re-purposed as a vanity. I'm super psyched at how it turned out, all for less than $3k (plus a LOT of time and effort, of course...)
More details are on the Bathroom forum link, below.

Here is a link that might be useful: Bathroom forum post about this bathroom

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clipped on: 02.02.2011 at 04:36 pm    last updated on: 02.02.2011 at 04:36 pm

Finished Kitchen - some pics

posted by: katyde on 01.23.2011 at 01:21 pm in Kitchens Forum

I am just attaching my Picasa link - hope you all enjoy the photos! I have been too busy to really be on this site but I did receive a lot of inspiration from everyone here so I wanted to share some finished pics.
This is a list of the details of our project - everything went off without a hitch!
Our GC's were amazing - anyone in the SE PA/Northern DE area looking for custom work (carpentry/renovation) should check them out.

Kitchen:
Construction/GC: Paul's Woodshop - Wilmington DE
(www.paulswoodshop.net)
Cabinets: Kahle's Kitchens (Deluxe cases; door is a merge between Allison and Warren reverse panel)
Cab. Colors: perimeter - maple painted "white"; island - cherry with "bordeaux" stain
Counters: Ice Brown (similar to Alaska White and Delicatus) - colonial marble and granite in KOP, PA
Samsung Refrigerator
GE Cafe dual fuel range
Zephyr Tempest I hood
Kenmore Elite DW
GE Profile space saver MW
Tile: Avalon Tile - 3x6 house brand creamy white crackle subway, and 20x20 "luxor red" floor tile (BS grout - Tec "Pearl"; floor Mapei "Chamois")
Faucets: KWC Eve and Insinkerator hot/cold filtered - both in chrome
Hardware: all polished nickle, knobs by RH (lugarno 1 1/4"); pulls by Rejuvenation (arched mission pull)
Lighting: pendants Hudson Valley Haverhill Pendants (polished nickle); undercab by seagull, 5"recessed cans by light-o-lier, hall and laundry fixtures: RH
Paint: SW Rice Grain
Barstools: West Elm

Here is a link that might be useful: Katyde picasa albums - before and after

NOTES:

floor tiles, large simple and neat
clipped on: 01.24.2011 at 10:13 am    last updated on: 01.24.2011 at 10:14 am

RE: Favorite online sources that are still in business? (Follow-Up #18)

posted by: flyinghigh on 04.17.2009 at 03:04 pm in Kitchens Forum

I too like a few of the ones mentioned above but would also throw out there one of my long-time favorites SinksGallery.com. Sinks Gallery has some very unique things that I haven't been able to find anywhere else. They also have a "sister company" Art Lighting Gallery where I have bought a few hand blown glass pendants. They do a lot of custom work and their cusotmer service folks are some of the best I have ever spoken with - more like "consultants". When I have bought a package of sinks, faucets, accessories, etc. they have always extended a decent discount.

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clipped on: 05.23.2009 at 03:09 pm    last updated on: 05.23.2009 at 03:09 pm

RE: Favorite online sources that are still in business? (Follow-Up #12)

posted by: skellar187 on 04.16.2009 at 09:50 am in Kitchens Forum

the best prices i have found online are from homecenter.com -- i got my blanco sink for $670 (approx 30 x 20) and my range hood for $550 (900 cfm, wall mount, chimney style). they both came to me within 5 days. good luck!

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clipped on: 05.23.2009 at 03:07 pm    last updated on: 05.23.2009 at 03:08 pm

RE: Good granite dealers in north/central Jersey? (Follow-Up #2)

posted by: ma-bookreader on 04.22.2009 at 11:10 pm in Kitchens Forum

I can highly recommend a company that is near you.
Berkeley Tile & Marble
They are on Springfield Ave in Berkeley Heights.

They did a granite counter top for my parents and were so great to work with that we used them also (They installed a - engineered stone - counter top for us.) We chose Cambria because when he saw the kind of granite samples I was choosing, he suggested that I look at Cambria as it would give me the same look at a slightly lower cost. We ended up following his advice and have no regrets.

I have children also and when the workmen were in my house, they were good with my kids.
Also, when they did the installation, there was a] problem with the templating for one of the pieces. It was off by just a bit. He did not even try to make it work (as I am sure many others would have done). He said, this piece is not cut right and it won't look right. We will get a new piece. They came back with a new piece (I forget how long -not more than a week) and that was a perfect fit. He would not accept an 'almost' fit. Our counter was installed in September.

Here is a link that might be useful: Berkeley Tile & Marble.

NOTES:

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clipped on: 04.24.2009 at 04:31 pm    last updated on: 04.24.2009 at 04:32 pm

RE: Good granite dealers in north/central Jersey? (Follow-Up #1)

posted by: cat_mom on 04.22.2009 at 10:45 pm in Kitchens Forum

IGM in North Bregen (Tonnely Ave?) had a nice selection when we got our granite there 2-2 years ago. Ask for Rick or Cindy.

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clipped on: 04.24.2009 at 04:31 pm    last updated on: 04.24.2009 at 04:31 pm

RE: 90 something & finished, need backsplash advice-PICS (Follow-Up #38)

posted by: lsandler on 03.11.2009 at 11:46 pm in Kitchens Forum

teppy--the tile is from Westminster Ceramics that has gone out of business.

Here's another pic of my kitchen where you can see the BS better:

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NOTES:

love the backsplash
clipped on: 03.12.2009 at 11:31 am    last updated on: 03.12.2009 at 11:32 am

india~ukraine~norway~finland (Follow-Up #3)

posted by: petra_granite on 01.27.2009 at 05:24 pm in Kitchens Forum

http://www.india-granite.com/
"World's First Granite Temple. The Brihadeswara temple at Tanjavur in Tamil Nadu is the first temple in the world to be built with granite"

granite from india: probably the most dense : no sealer needed: or maybe one time sealing:

and
http://www.lundhs.no/types_of_material/cms/54

labradorite////Anorthosites

Natural stone from : Ukraine, Norway, Finland:
emerald pearl, blue pearl, volga blue, labrador antique: never have to seal! never stains: should never stain.

My very favorites are from Ukraine, Norway and Finland

**all said: I still believe there is a need to use the correct cleaners to maintain the beauty of the stone and keep looking beautiful. Always wiping up spills immediately no matter what!

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clipped on: 01.28.2009 at 06:24 pm    last updated on: 01.28.2009 at 06:24 pm

After a bit of searching (Follow-Up #10)

posted by: houseful on 01.28.2009 at 11:53 am in Kitchens Forum

Look what I found!

Here is a link that might be useful: Tropical green countertop

NOTES:

really pretty movement
clipped on: 01.28.2009 at 06:20 pm    last updated on: 01.28.2009 at 06:20 pm

RE: I'm stressing - what granite would u choose (Follow-Up #6)

posted by: susan4664 on 01.28.2009 at 10:46 am in Kitchens Forum

Lisa,
I also have dark cabinets and a medium light floor. I am very partial to the dark green granites so that is what I chose (Peacock Green). I went with a medium-light tumbled marble backsplash to break it up. I felt that full granite backsplash would make the room dark and closed in feeling.

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Kitchen side

NOTES:

nice
clipped on: 01.28.2009 at 06:19 pm    last updated on: 01.28.2009 at 06:20 pm