Clippings by elizabethzen

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RE: Walk in Closet PICS? (Follow-Up #9)

posted by: igloochic on 08.17.2008 at 10:35 pm in Organizing the Home Forum

I should have posted my before pic Becky...I did that one myself. It hung about ohhh 45 degrees off of level from front to back and side to side. My cats could slide down from one end to the other :) One day we put a coat on..and it all came down LOL So, with that experience in mind, I had this one done on my design. It's done in walnut, some veneer, some solid. And it was done on a budget (I almost stuck to it) of $5,000. The added value (per our appraisor on the closet alone) is over $20,000 to our home, so I thought it was a good investment.

Thank you for the compliment. I absolutely love the's funny, but I can go in there and "see" the finished house sometimes LOL Almost everyone ohhhss and ahhhhsss when they see it, and frankly, it was the lowest cost room to do :)


walin in/sewing room 2
clipped on: 08.19.2008 at 01:14 pm    last updated on: 08.19.2008 at 01:15 pm

RE: Walk in Closet PICS? (Follow-Up #7)

posted by: igloochic on 08.17.2008 at 01:43 pm in Organizing the Home Forum

Mine is about 9x15. It's not only a walk in closet, but also my sewing room (counter with the window) and acts as a nursey currently as well. It's still in progress, with doors to be added to the boxes on the left side, and lighting to go in the glass door cabinets. All glass door cabinets on the right have bars (shirts, pants and skirts). To the back side it has a long storage area for ballgowns, fur coats, and other less used items. (I say that like I have 42 fur coats LOL I don't). Then there is a shelf that run around the entire room aside from the window wall which will house less used items. There are still a few trim pieces to install and rods, but to give an idea, here's a few pics.

THe lighting is just for show during the inspection. It will be replaced with a gorgeous antique fixture. The walls are being done in venetian plaster. (Should be done this week).

We stole the space for this closet from our master bedroom. It had been a sitting area. When we remodeled we took space for the closet (just built a simple wall) and added to the master bath by stealing the space in two linen closets we had filled with junk we didn't need. The room was huge before (658 sq ft) and is still good size, but the closet makes it SOOO much more functional. We also removed a silly soaker tub that was IN the bedroom and used that plumbing to add a stackable washer and dryer on the same floor (the other one is four levels down in the five level townhouse). Removing the tub gave us the sitting area we took for this closet.


Obviously we could use a few knobs and pulls LOL but we'll get there! In fact, thank you for this question....because it reminds me to order them today!


walk in closet/sewing room
clipped on: 08.19.2008 at 01:12 pm    last updated on: 08.19.2008 at 01:13 pm

RE: Update request: Organic_Donna & Okwriter (Follow-Up #7)

posted by: organic_donna on 05.27.2008 at 05:58 pm in Kitchen Table Forum


These pictures did not turn out very well. At least you have an idea.


Organic Donna's bath remode
clipped on: 08.09.2008 at 05:39 pm    last updated on: 08.09.2008 at 05:40 pm

RE: What to do with fresh cranberries, not sauce please (Follow-Up #9)

posted by: grainlady on 11.19.2007 at 03:30 pm in Cooking Forum

I have an Ocean Spray Cookbook with over 200 recipes including appetizers, beverages, desserts and more (Copyright 1995). It uses both canned whole/jelled and fresh/frozen whole cranberries in the recipes. Many of the same recipes appear at their web site:

My all-time favorite use for fresh cranberries is this recipe:

(source: SuperFoods - by Steeven Pratt, M.D., and Kathy Matthews)

Makes about 3 cups (I tend to make half a recipe.)

1 12-oz. package Ocean Spray fresh or frozen cranberries, rinsed and drained
1 UNpeeled orange (washed), cut into eights and seeded
3/4 c. sugar (I use 1/3 c. agave nectar - low-glycemic)

Place half the cranberries and half the orange pieces in a food processor and process until the mixture is evenly chopped. Transfer to a bowl. Repeat with the remaining cranberries and orange slices. Store in the refrigerator or freezer until ready to serve.

So simple - so tasty!


Cranberry Orange relish
clipped on: 11.23.2007 at 10:04 am    last updated on: 11.23.2007 at 10:05 am

RE: What to do with fresh cranberries, not sauce please (Follow-Up #6)

posted by: msazadi on 11.19.2007 at 01:07 pm in Cooking Forum

There are pickled cranberries, cranberry chutney...neither of which I've made yet.

This one is on my to do list...
DESSERT Cranberry Walnut Tart via doucanoe
Sweet pastry dough
3 large eggs
2/3 cup packed dark brown sugar
2/3 cup light corn syrup
1/2 stick (1/4 cup) unsalted butter, melted and cooled
1/2 teaspoon salt
1 teaspoon vanilla
1 1/4 cups chopped fresh or frozen cranberries (7 oz; thawed if frozen)
1 cup chopped walnuts (1/4 lb)
Special equipment: a 10- to 11-inch round tart pan (1 inch deep) with a removable bottom; pie weights or raw rice
Make shell:
Roll out dough into a 13-inch round (1/8 inch thick) on a floured surface with a floured rolling pin and fit into tart pan. Trim edge of dough, leaving a 1/2-inch overhang, then fold overhang inward and press against side of pan to reinforce edge. Lightly prick bottom of shell all over with a fork, then chill 30 minutes.
Put oven rack in lower third of oven and preheat oven to 425F. Line shell with foil and fill with pie weights.
Bake until pastry is set and pale golden on rim, about 15 minutes. Carefully remove foil and weights and bake shell until pale golden all over, 5 to 10 minutes more. Transfer shell in pan to a rack.
Make filling:
Move oven rack to middle position and reduce oven temperature to 350F.
Whisk together eggs, brown sugar, corn syrup, butter, salt, and vanilla in a bowl until smooth, then stir in cranberries and walnuts.
Pour filling into shell and bake tart until filling is set and golden, 40 to 45 minutes. (If pastry edge darkens before tart is done, cover edge with a pie shield or foil.) Cool completely in pan on rack.
Cooks' notes:
Tart can be baked 1 day ahead and kept, covered, at room temperature.
This is one of our favorites...
DESSERT Drenched Cranberry Cake via LoriJean

2 cups all-purpose flour
1 cup sugar
2-1/2 tsp. baking powder
3 Tablespoons butter, melted
2/3 cup milk
1 egg
2 cups fresh or frozen cranberries (or blueberries)

1/2 cup (1 stick) unsalted butter
1 cup sugar
3/4 cup heavy cream
1/2 vanilla bean, split lengthwise

Preheat the oven to 350 F. Butter a 9-inch round pan.

Sift the flour, sugar, and baking powder into a large bowl. Add the butter, milk, and egg. Beat for 2 minutes, or until smooth. Stir in the cranberries. Pour into the prepared pan, smooth the top, and bake for 1 hour, or until an inserted toothpick comes out clean.

Transfer to a wire rack to cool, then remove from pan when cool.

To make the sauce: Melt the butter in a small saucepan over low heat. Add the sugar, cream, and vanilla bean. Stir to mix well. Cook, stirring occasionally, for 5 minutes. Remove the vanilla bean.

Serve the cake with each individual slice generously drenched with the warmed sauce.
And these are decadent...Does anyone claim these so I can credit you?

DESSERT Cranberry Bliss Bars

1 cup (2 sticks) butter, softened
1 1/4 cups light brown sugar, packed
3 eggs
1 1/2 teaspoons vanilla
1 teaspoon ground ginger
1/4 teaspoon salt
1 1/2 cups all-purpose flour
3/4 cup diced dried cranberries
6 ounces white chocolate, cut into chunks

4-ounces cream cheese, softened
3 cups powdered sugar
4 teaspoons lemon juice
1/2 teaspoon vanilla extract
1/4 cup diced dried cranberries
Drizzled Icing
1/2 cup powdered sugar
1 tablespoon milk
2 teaspoons vegetable shortening

1. Preheat oven to 350 degrees.

2. Make cake by beating butter and brown sugar together with an electric mixer until smooth. Add eggs, vanilla, ginger, and salt and beat well. Gradually mix in flour until smooth. Mix 3/4 cup diced dried cranberries and white chocolate into the batter by hand. Pour batter into a well-greased 9x13-inch baking pan. Use a spatula to spread the batter evenly across the pan. Bake for 35 to 40 minutes or until cake is light brown on the edges. Allow cake to cool.

3. Make frosting by combining softened cream cheese, 3 cups powdered sugar, lemon juice and vanilla extract in a medium bowl with an electric mixer until smooth. When the cake has cooled, use a spatula to spread frosting over the top of the cake.

4. Sprinkle 1/4 cup of diced cranberries over the frosting on the cake.

5. Whisk together 1/2 cup powdered sugar, 1 tablespoon milk, and shortening. Drizzle icing over the cranberries in a sweeping motion or use a pastry bag with a fine tip to drizzle frosting across the top of the cake.

6. Allow cake to sit for several hours, then slice the cake lengthwise (the long way) through the middle. Slice the cake across the width three times making a total of eight rectangular slices. Slice each of those rectangles diagonally creating 16 triangular slices.

16 bars


Cranberry cake
clipped on: 11.23.2007 at 10:02 am    last updated on: 11.23.2007 at 10:02 am

RE: Quick Breads (Follow-Up #4)

posted by: dgkritch on 11.13.2007 at 02:24 pm in Cooking Forum

Here's a delicious one I found last year...

PEAR BREAD (Really good!)
1 c. vegetable oil
2 c. granulated sugar
3 eggs
2 1/2 c. peeled and chopped fresh pears (4 med.)
1 c. chopped pecans
2 tsp. vanilla extract
3 c. all-purpose flour
1 tsp. baking soda
1/2 tsp. salt
1 tsp. ground cinnamon
1/2 tsp. ground nutmeg

Preheat oven to 350 degrees.

In a medium mixing bowl, combine oil, sugar and eggs, blending well.
Stir in pears, pecans and vanilla. In another bowl, combine remaining ingredients.

Stir dry ingredients into pear mixture, pour the batter into two greased 8 1/2 x 4 1/2 x 2 3/4 inch loaf pans, or until a toothpick inserted in the middle comes out clean.

Cool loaves 10 minutes, then remove from pans and cool on the wire racks.
Makes two loaves.


Pear Bread
clipped on: 11.14.2007 at 08:21 pm    last updated on: 11.14.2007 at 08:22 pm

RE: Viking Cookware (Follow-Up #1)

posted by: solarpowered on 10.03.2007 at 01:53 am in Cookware Forum

It appears to be cookware custom made for Viking by Demeyere.

The Demeyere cookware is superb. I see the following differences:

1. The Demeyere products have welded rather than riveted handles. So, no rivets to clean around on the Demeyere!

2. Different construction is used on some pans:

a. On pans with curved bottoms, the construction would appear to be virtually the same in the Viking and the Demeyere Atlantis, Apollo and Sirocco lines. That is, aluminum-core construction which extends from rim to rim.

b. On pans with flat bottoms, the Viking is again straight-gauge from rim to rim. Atlantis and Sirocco have heavy copper disks in bottom, which are encapsulated in stainless steel. The disks extend the full diameter of the pan, so there is no problem with "burn rings" at the edges of the pans. Apollo has an aluminum disk bottom, that doesn't quite cover the whole bottom.

Demeyere says that their research shows that this construction for flat-bottom cookware is superior to straight-gauge construction from the point of view of cooking performance. My experience is that it indeed works very well.

3. The Atlantis and Apollo lines have Demeyere's "Silvinox" finish, which is extremely tough, and they recommend that it be washed in the dishwasher. The Viking line (and probablly Sirocco also, but I'm not sure) doesn't have the Silvinox finish, and they recommend that you hand wash it.

4. All of them are induction-capable.

5. It appears that the Viking-labeled cookware is even more expensive than the Demeyere labels.

I have Demeyere Atlantis cookware, and I find it to be absolutely superb. The Silvinox finish works very well--it stays much nicer-looking than my other SS cookware, and is considerably easier to clean. I researched cookware extensively before I started buying Atlantis, and in my opinion it is absolutely the best SS cookware available. When compared with the prices for the Viking versions, I think getting the actual Demeyere-labeled product is a no-brainer.


Demeyere and Viking cookware
clipped on: 11.10.2007 at 02:53 pm    last updated on: 11.10.2007 at 02:54 pm

RE: Demeyere Apollo-which frypan? (Follow-Up #3)

posted by: food_nut79 on 11.08.2007 at 12:38 pm in Cookware Forum

If your looking at purchasing a set of Apollo Cookware, then there is only one 5-star skillet available in that line and that is the Proline skillet. As dbabuy said, it has a 4.8mm thick core that runs up the sides of the pan.

As for Restoglide/Duraglide, I would stay away from these. Its not that they are "bad", its just that they are not even remotely comparable to the Apollo cookware. If any retailer is offering these as an option for an Apollo set, they are undoubtedly trying to pocket the difference.

Now we move on to the 4-star pans and how they compare with the 5-star. Because of the thicker core, the five-star has a greater mass which helps in regulating and controlling heat. With that said, though, 3-mm thick is pretty comparable to alot of other brands like All-clad stainless, Calphalon Tri-Ply and Cuisinart Multi-Clad. So unless you are a REALLY demanding chef, I would wager that most people wouldn't notice much of a performance difference.

However, I did notice you said that you had an interest in non-stick. If this is the case, then 4-star Multiglide is really your only choice. They don't make a non-stick Proline. And, like I said, I wouldn't go for the Duraglide.

I should mention that I have used the proline and selectine skillets, with the Silvinox and Brinox coatings. The Silvinox/Brinox is such a refined and pure form of stainless steel, that it is virtually non-stick, and in my opinion builds flavor better than non-stick cookware. Just my two cents, though.

As for sets/versus individual pieces - I always go individual. Whether its knives or cookware, you're going to come out on top with individual pieces that are specifically suited to what you use, rather than having a couple pieces from a set sit in a drawer because you never use them. My advice is to shop around for the best deal, as well. Good shopping and if you want more details, let me know and I'll do my best to help.


Demeyere cookware
clipped on: 11.10.2007 at 02:48 pm    last updated on: 11.10.2007 at 02:49 pm

RE: Do you have your microwave in your island? Can I see pics? (Follow-Up #1)

posted by: brownli on 05.11.2007 at 09:02 am in Kitchens Forum

Here's our Sharp Microwave drawer. We love this setup since with the drawer you don't have to bend down each time to use the microwave as you would with a 'door' microwave. Our island is 8 feet long.

Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket

Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket


clipped on: 07.11.2007 at 06:39 pm    last updated on: 07.11.2007 at 06:39 pm

RE: RECIPE: favorite lemon dishes 2 (Follow-Up #4)

posted by: Ann_T on 02.27.2005 at 03:51 pm in Recipe Exchange Forum

Besides lemon desserts there are a number of savory dishes I like to use lemon in. A new favourite is Chicken wings rubbed with lemon zest, garlic, sea salt and coarsely ground black pepper. Many of the Greek dishes I make has lemon in them. Greek ribs and Chicken/Pork Souvlaki are marinaded in lemon juice before grilling. And I add lemon to roasted lamb and the Greek potatoes.

Home Cookin 4.9 Chapter: Recipes From Thibeault's Table

Chicken - Pollo Alla Marengo

adjusted : from The Art of Eating Well, Pellegrino Artusi 1820 - 1911, Italy's Most Treasured Cookbook, Translated by Kyle M. Phillips III.

On the eve of the battle of Marengo, Napoleon's cook was unable to find the chuck wagons in the confusion and was forced to improvise, using stolen hens. The dish became known as chicken marengo, and tis said that Napoleon always enjoyed it, less for iteself than because it reminded him of a glorious victory.

Chop a young chicken into pieces at the joints. Saute it with 2 tablespoons butter and 1 of oil, season it with salt and pepper, and a pinch of nutmeg. Once the pieces are browned on all sides, drain off the fat, dust the meat with flour, add a minced clove or two of garlic, and add 1/2 cup of dry white wine. Add about 1/2 cup of broth over the chicken to keep it from drying out, cover it, and simmer it until done. Before serving it, sprinkle it with minced parsley and squeeze half a lemon over it.

Home Cookin 4.9 Chapter: Recipes From Thibeault's Table

Greek Meatballs With Avgolemono Sauce
These are extremely tender and flavourful meatballs

1 1/4 lbs Lean Ground Beef
1/2 lb lean ground pork
2 slices of bread, made into crumbs and soaked with milk
3 garlic cloves
1 small grated onion
2 tablespoons chopped parsely
1/2 to 1 cup chopped spinach, squeezed dry
1 tablespoon chopped mint
2 teaspoon grated lemon zest
1 teaspoons dried oregano
2 eggs
1/3 cup uncooked rice
salt and pepper to taste

Option: Add some fresh chopped dill as well

5 cups chicken broth


2 egg yolks
1 whole egg
juice of 1 large lemon (1/4 cup)
1 1/2 cups of broth (from cooking meatballs)

Makes approximately 48 meatballs.

As an alternative to the egg/lemon sauce, try doing this instead:
Make a roux with butter and flour, add the chicken stock that you cooked the meatballs in, simmer, add some of the hot sauce to an egg yolk and then slowly stir the mixture back into the remaining sauce. Add lemon juice. Add the meatballs and simmer on low for a few minutes. Do not boil if using the egg yolk.

Mix the two meats together well and add the rest of the ingredients and mix
well using hands.

Saute a small amount to taste for seasoning and adjust seasoning as needed.

Form into meatballs the size of walnuts and saute until brown. Drain on
paper towels and then add to a pot of chicken broth.

Simmer for 40 minutes until tender.

Remove meatballs from broth. Strain broth and reserve 1 1/2 cups. Return
broth to stove and bring to a boil.

Beat egg yolks and egg with lemon juice and slowly whisk the hot broth into
egg mixture.

Return sauce to sauce pan and heat on low stirring until sauce thickens. Do
not bring to a boil.

Add meatballs and continute to heat until meatballs are hot and coated with

Home Cookin 4.9 Chapter: Recipes From Thibeault's Table

Lamb with Wild Greens and Egg-Lemon Sauce (Arni Fricassee)
Lamb with Wild Greens and Egg-Lemon Sauce (Arni Fricassee)

Source: Krinos

1/2 cup Krinos olive oil
2 1/2 pounds boneless lamb, cut into stewing size pieces
2 large red onions, peeled, halved and sliced
2 garlic cloves, peeled and chopped
Salt, pepper to taste
1 cup dry white wine
3 pounds dandelion, chard or spinach, trimmed, washed and drained well
1 bunch dill, chopped
2 eggs
Strained juice of 1-2 lemons

1. Heat the olive oil and brown the lamb. Add the onion and saut until
golden. Stir in the garlic, salt and pepper. Add the wine and enough water
to cover the meat. Bring to a boil and simmer, covered, for about 40

2. In a separate pot filled with a little water, steam the greens until
wilted and drain. Add the steamed greens to the lamb, together with the
dill, and continue cooking another 25-30 minutes. Add water if necessary.

3. Beat the eggs until frothy and add the lemon juice, beating. Take a
ladleful of the simmering pot juices from the lamb and gradually drizzle
them into the egg-lemon mixture, beating all the while. Quickly pour the
mixture back into the pot, stir to combine and remove from heat. Season with
salt and pepper and serve immediately.
Yield: 4-6 servings

Servings: 4


clipped on: 06.13.2007 at 09:16 pm    last updated on: 06.13.2007 at 09:16 pm

RECIPE: My Grandmother's Swedish Rye Bread (for bread makers)

posted by: conifers on 05.02.2007 at 02:45 pm in Recipe Exchange Forum

Hello, never posted here but thought I'd share what my mom has been making for years from a recipe she reduced from her mothers Swedish Rye Bread Recipe:

Grandma Wongstrom's Rye Bread
Serving Size: 1 Preparation Time : 4:00
Categories Breads

10 ounces water
1 tablespoon butter
1 teaspoon salt
2 tablespoons white sugar
1/4 cup Brer Rabbit light molasses (she says non-light tastes the same but her mother says, "the non-light!" in a joking manner she said to me)
1/2 cup rye flour, 100% rye
2 3/4 cups white bread flour
1 1/2 teaspoons bread yeast

Place butter, salt, white sugar, and molasses in a glass bowl and microwave for 90 seconds. Remove, stir ingredients, and place in bread maker pan.

Place rye and white bread flour on top of liquids. Make a hole in center of flour and place the bread yeast in it. This part I don't understand because I was over and made a loaf and all we did was mix the rest of the ingredients together and toss them in the bread machine.

Set your controls for 1 1/2 pound loaf and medium crust (or whatever you prefer).

She had to order the rye flour from Hodgson Mills in Effingham, IL she says. She also references that, "it is difficult... to find in (our) local grocery stores."

It's really fantastic, so give it a try. She also waits two hours for it to cool.

Enjoy Please! You'll never want to eat anything else. Mom had a chunk with her homemade vegetable soup and said the experience was super!

Take care,



clipped on: 06.13.2007 at 08:28 pm    last updated on: 06.13.2007 at 08:28 pm

RE: Homemade tortillas (Follow-Up #18)

posted by: grainlady on 01.19.2006 at 03:59 pm in Once-a-Week Cooking Forum

Here's a couple more recipes. Once I used the in-a-bag method from the Native American Tortillas In a Bag recipe, I've made all my tortilla that way. Great for the kids who like to help cook, and easy clean-up. I have a tortilla maker/baker, but rolling them with a rolling pin, or smashing them in a tortilla maker are also good ways to get the job done. I stick all the extras in the freezer. You can cut them and bake them for homemade tortilla chips. We also warm up the tortillas in the toaster oven until they are crispy and use them flat for tostadas. -Grainlady

Native American tortillas in a Bag
(Source: Kansas Wheat Commission ( 2001 Recipes)

1-1/2 cups all-purpose flour*
1 t. baking powder
1/2 t. salt
2 T. shortening (I don't use shortening because it's a trans fatty acid, but use coconut oil, butter, or olive oil instead.)
1/2 c. hot water

In a large self-locking plastic bag, combine flour, baking powder and salt. Close bag and shake to mix. Add shortening and work into flour until fine particles form. Add the hot water and knead the dough in the bag until it forms a ball.

Remove dough from bag and place on a lightly floured work surface; knead 15 strokes. Divide into six (or more if you want smaller tortillas) equal pieces; shape into balls. Cover; let rest 15 minutes.

On a lightly floured surface, roll each piece as thinn as possible. Roll from the center out, turning several times to form an 8-inch circle.

Heat an ungreased griddle or skillet over medium heat. Cook until the surface begins to bubble and the under side is speckled golden-brown, about 15-20 seconds. Cook other side. Stack tortillas under a cloth as they are done and serve warm. Makes 6 tortillas.

*Variation: Use 1/2 c. corn meal and 1 c. all-purpose flour, or use 3/4 c. whole wheat flour and 3/4 c. all-purpose flour.

Wheat and Sesame Tortillas
(Source: Natural Meals In Minutes by Rita Bingham)
2 c. whole wheat (can use part all-purpose)
3 T. dry milk powder
1/3 c. sesame seeds (these really taste great in the tortillas)
2 T. butter or applesauce as a fat replacer
1/2 t. salt
2 T. yogurt
1/2 c. lukewarm water

Combine dry ingredients. Use hand or electric beaters to cut in butter or applesauce until mixture resembles fine crumbs. Slowly pour in water and yogurt, mixing lightly with a fork. On a floured board, knead dough until smooth and elastic, about 5 minutes. Shape into a ball, cover and let stand for 10 minutes.

Divide and shape dough into 8 balls. Cover, removing one ball at a time and roll paper-thin on floured board. Place on heavy, hot, ungreased skillet, over medium-high heat. Blisters should appear right away. Brown on one side and turn. Cook about 30 secones. Makes eight 9-inch tortillas.


clipped on: 06.13.2007 at 08:23 pm    last updated on: 06.13.2007 at 08:23 pm

RE: deDietrich 308x - anyone know how to wire this in? (Follow-Up #1)

posted by: aliceinwonderland_id on 02.12.2007 at 06:40 pm in Appliances Forum

I have a Brandt, not a De Dietrich, but manufactured by the same company. The issue you will run into is that European power is wired differently from US power.

Your house power to the cooktop should have four wires:
1) black - this is a hot lead, 110v
2) Red or black - this is also a hot lead, 110v but 180 degrees out of phase with the other hot lead
3) white - neutral.
4) green - ground

Your cooktop should have:
1) black, designated L1 (live wire #1)
2) black, designated L2 (live wire #2)
3) Blue - neutral
4) brown - neutral
5) green/yellow - ground

Take the two black wires from the cooktop, and hook them to the black wire from the house.

Take the blue and brown wires from the cooktop and hook to the red wire from the house.

Take the green/yellow wire from the cooktop and hook to the white wire from the house.

Cap the green wire from the house.

Why do it this way? In Europe, the house black wire would carry 240v, single phase, the neutral wire goes to ground and the ground wire goes to ground (as a redundant safety wire). In the US, the black and red wires each carry 120v, bub 180 degrees out of phase so the difference between the two is 240v [Think of this like a 180 foot hill next to a 180 foot deep hole in the ground - the distance from the top of the hill to the bottom of the hole is 240 feet]. So, the only way to get 240v to through the cooktop with US power is too hook up one hot lead to the live and the other to the neutral.

Neutral and ground wires perform the exact same function - they both go to ground in order to complete the circuit. Neutral wires are a heavier gauge because they are designed to be used continuously. Ground wires are lighter gauge because they are designed to be a redundant system, used in the event of a short. That is why it is better to hook the cooktop ground wire to the house neutral rather than the house ground - you end up with a more robust circuit "just in case."


clipped on: 05.28.2007 at 02:25 pm    last updated on: 05.28.2007 at 02:25 pm

RE: LED undercabs(Pics) (Follow-Up #14)

posted by: ramses_2 on 01.02.2007 at 11:01 pm in Kitchens Forum

Our LEDs are 3000K color temp. which has a spectrum similar to sunlight (white-yellow). The LED Strips are also available in 7000K color temp. which put out a little more light, but they have more blue in their light spectrum.

The LEDs are very power efficient (about 15W total for all the cabinet LEDs) and they are cool to the touch.

We mounted the LED strips on the front edge of the underside of the cabinets and aimed them at the backsplash, so we don't have any glare off the counter top.

Here is a link that might be useful: LEDtronics LED Strips


clipped on: 01.03.2007 at 07:22 am    last updated on: 01.03.2007 at 07:23 am

LED undercabs(Pics)

posted by: ramses_2 on 01.02.2007 at 12:21 pm in Kitchens Forum

So finally after a year DH wore me down and it was pretty clear that if I wanted undercabs I would need to go with LEDs. I feared they'd be to harsh but strangely enough, I really like them. These aren't fantastic pics, in some the lights seem to almost glow. In reality they are a lovely light that's perfect for tasks and ambiance.

Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting

Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting

Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting

Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting

Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting


clipped on: 01.03.2007 at 07:21 am    last updated on: 01.03.2007 at 07:22 am

RE: 8' Ceilings & Cabinets to the Ceiling (Follow-Up #11)

posted by: stephanielynn on 12.27.2006 at 08:00 pm in Kitchens Forum

96" ceilings, 40" uppers, small scribe molding.

Image Hosting by

Image Hosting by


wall cab molding
clipped on: 12.29.2006 at 02:02 pm    last updated on: 12.29.2006 at 02:02 pm

RE: WARNING: Bar Keepers Friend and Nickel (Follow-Up #25)

posted by: rococogurl on 11.14.2006 at 11:36 am in Kitchens Forum

Laurie, I have all the ones you do and you do need different cleaning products but its no biggie. Less, not more.

Marble & granite are cleaned with hot water. You can get a marble polish & a granite polish or stone cleaners and use those periodically.

Flitz will not remove nickel finish and does a great job -- I linked it above.

I use 3M stainless cleaner and a miracle cloth for my counters and appliances. works great.

I don't clean the bronze and I have integral bronze door handles. Just wipe with miracle cloth.


kitchen cleaners that won't destroy
clipped on: 12.08.2006 at 06:04 am    last updated on: 12.08.2006 at 06:04 am

RE: WARNING: Bar Keepers Friend and Nickel (Follow-Up #19)

posted by: rococogurl on 10.03.2006 at 04:07 pm in Kitchens Forum

miss marble -- Don't know which sink you have. My ss drain brands are Lira (Italy) and Elkay. Believe it is correctly called sink basket and strainer (or pop up if you want that).

The Flitz is not abrasive and should not be left to dry on anything according to the tube I have (it does come in smaller amounts!). I have nickel dot tiles in my bathroom floor and use it on those as well. I know that nickel tarnishes slightly so there is tarnish that comes off the tiles as well and they brighten. It does not feel abrasive and can evidently be used on paint and some plastic as well as the metals.

The folks at Rohl recommended it to me when I bought my sink and satin nickel faucet.


sink basket and strainer - integral SS best
clipped on: 12.08.2006 at 06:02 am    last updated on: 12.08.2006 at 06:03 am

RE: WARNING: Bar Keepers Friend and Nickel (Follow-Up #14)

posted by: sombreuil_mongrel on 10.02.2006 at 08:31 am in Kitchens Forum

I never used Flitz, so I don't know how abrasive it is, but if your polishing cloth turns black as you are working, you are removing the plated finish. It's only a matter of repetition until it is worn through.
Rub gently with a low-abrasive polish. Repeat infrequently.
Brasso is about the most harmful thing for a plated finish. It contains a coarse abrasive and is full of ammonia (which on its own is really bad for brass- it breaks the molecular bond between the copper and zinc!)


clipped on: 12.08.2006 at 05:59 am    last updated on: 12.08.2006 at 05:59 am

RE: WARNING: Bar Keepers Friend and Nickel (Follow-Up #10)

posted by: rococogurl on 09.30.2006 at 11:45 pm in Kitchens Forum

Most definitely there is stainless sink drain assemblies and strainers -- I have 2. It's what I bought for the house because in our apartment I have an old chrome one with the finish wearing off. They are expensive but the finish is integral so there will not be cleanser or other issues as I like ammonia for cleaning bbq grates and rosting pans.

Patricia, you may have removed some type of sealer/lacquer with the BKF. I'm sure a call to GE customer service could tell you what's on there.

Miss m -- Flitz is a metal cleaner that also will clean copper. I've always used kosher salt and vinegar to clean copper but with a nickel drain I'd say Flitz is safest. I get it in tubes but they have a website (suprise).

Here is a link that might be useful: Flitz


Flitz website
clipped on: 12.08.2006 at 05:58 am    last updated on: 12.08.2006 at 05:58 am

RE: WARNING: Bar Keepers Friend and Nickel (Follow-Up #5)

posted by: sombreuil_mongrel on 09.30.2006 at 09:24 pm in Kitchens Forum

You have to be super-cautious with anything that is metal-plated. Solid things, like SS appliances are one thing, but faucets with any kind of finish except solid unlacquered brass should be treated with great care. One metal polish that will do virtually no harm can be found at auto parts stores. "Mother's Chrome Polish" it basically has no abrasive, and is even safe for chrome-plated plastic finishes. Lots of elbow grease in every bottle, though.


clipped on: 12.08.2006 at 05:55 am    last updated on: 12.08.2006 at 05:55 am

RE: WARNING: Bar Keepers Friend and Nickel (Follow-Up #3)

posted by: rococogurl on 09.30.2006 at 08:41 pm in Kitchens Forum

BKF shouldn't be used on nickel. There have been a few posts but perhaps not enough as it's an easy mistake to make. So sorry about your problems. It's great for fireclay and stainless and even enamled oven pans, also bbq grills.

Flitz is the stuff to use for nickel. It comes in a tube and does a great job. But mostly I use warm water and a miracle cloth to keep tarnish away and use the Flitz quarterly.


cleaner for nickel - Flitz or mircle cloth and water
clipped on: 12.08.2006 at 05:52 am    last updated on: 12.08.2006 at 05:53 am

RE: De Detriech induction installation (Follow-Up #21)

posted by: esmith627 on 11.27.2006 at 02:48 pm in Appliances Forum

I got an email today from Andy Wilkinson. It's a little long but I'll post the whole message. I think you'll find it exciting!
This is his email
Thanks for your interest in De Dietrich.
First a little background on our company. We've been in the distribution business for over 42 years and have 4 branches in North Carolina. Our main business is plumbing distribution of pipes and tubs to plumbing contractors but we also have 3 very high end plumbing and door hardware showrooms. We are just now opening a high end design center in the Asheville, N.C. area serving western N.C. In addition to plumbing and door hardware we are also offering tile, appliances, cabinetry, stone, doors, flooring, lighting and associated products.
In my investigation over the previous 2 years regarding which appliances to distribute I came across the Gardenweb site. Several of the lines we handle came directly from the forum. I realized the contributors were passionate about their selections and I knew they were more informed than I would ever be. Their dissertations even changed my direction somewhat in the lines that I decided to display. I chose not to display the "main" high end brands and tried to select the more upscale niche oriented products that were new to the market; Liebherr, Capital, Turbo Chef, etc. You can see our offering at This of course is the name of our new design center, Salon Blue Ridge.
After doing some research on induction I came away with the same feeling as many others in your group, De Dietrich seemed to be the best value and have the most options. As a distributor I felt like the U.S. market could be served better from a domestic location as opposed to overseas. I contacted the principles at Woodall's to see if there could be a way we could possibly work together to better serve this market, and also see if it would be worthwhile monetarily. The margin we will receive on this line is not great by itself but maybe we can interest this De Dietrich client in other products. If not, it's not going to hurt us either. So we decided to take the plunge. We ordered out first crate of 20 pieces several weeks ago and I am waiting for an approximate arrival date. We will stock just the 308 and 309. Below is how our program for the U.S. is going to shake out, initially.
We will stock the product at Salon Blue Ridge for same day or next day shipping.
The price includes insurance of the product and delivery by UPS Ground to your doorstep. Any shipping damage is up to you to handle with UPS but I'm sure we can help if a real problem arises.
We will warrant the product for 2 years. This is not a manufacture's warranty, this is a Wilkinson/Salon Blue Ridge warranty. If you have a mechanical failure we will replace the part at no charge for a period of 2 years after the sale date. We plan to have parts in stock as soon as we figure out which ones go bad. We felt we needed to offer some type of warranty so hopefully this is adequate.
We have a service guy "on staff" at Salon Blue Ridge. As soon as we receive the product we will "tear it down" to become totally familiar with how it is put together. He will be able to answer any questions your installer or electrician may have. We will actually have one installed in our showroom so we should know any installation issues beforehand. Our service guy's name is Joe Barber. He used to be a forklift mechanic so appliances should be easy. We will have all the technical manuals and have overseas help in worse case conditions. Since De Dietrich is not officially selling this product to us they are out of the picture, but at arm's length. It is just a cooktop.
Special orders will be no problem. We do this every day. Lead time and price would be subject to whether the client needs the item air freight or can wait until our next ocean shipment.
Credit card no problem.
We plan to rebox the product, if needed, to keep shipping damage to a minimum. This seems to be the major issue.
Price on the 308X delivered is $1593.00 US, the 309X is $1959.00 US. These are initial prices. I think we can stay in this range but I need my final shipping and customs cost before the establishing the solid sales price. We will sell at these prices until I get all my costs and then may go up or down as needed.
Below you will find a contact list for Salon Blue Ridge. Anyone on this list has been aprised of the De Dietrich situation. For your persoanl situation if you have any follow up questions or need to place an order please contact Audrey Wilkinson, I'm a little biased, my daughter. Or feel free to contact me.


US de Dietrich dist.
clipped on: 11.27.2006 at 04:03 pm    last updated on: 11.27.2006 at 04:04 pm

RE: IKEA Cabinets okay for resale? (Follow-Up #8)

posted by: fisheggs on 11.21.2006 at 01:21 pm in Kitchens Forum

If you have the money, I'd spend it on an installer or carpenter who can do all the appropriate trim work and make them look really good. Either Ikea or Kraftmaid cabinets can look awful if the installation is sloppy. I was in Ikea Covina last weekend and the installers had done some amazing things with doors as end cover panels and the like that looked far better than what I'd seen in other Ikea showrooms. They'd done a really good job on the light rails and tile work, too. I've seen Ikea displays where there was splintered wood sticking out all over the place which made me wonder what on earth the management was thinking.


cab. installation
clipped on: 11.26.2006 at 07:29 pm    last updated on: 11.26.2006 at 07:29 pm

RE: De Detriech induction installation (Follow-Up #12)

posted by: sshrivastava on 11.23.2006 at 12:55 pm in Appliances Forum


Cutting it close as usual, the Dacor oven was installed on Monday, the granite counters on Tuesday, and the De Dietrich was put in on Wednesday along with all the new faucet fixtures and the new Blanco Silgranit undermount sink and related plumbing changes. Today is Thanksgiving -- talk about cutting it close!

We had a little confusion about the wiring of the 308X, which is the 30" model. There are two bundled neutral wires and two bundled live wires, along with a single ground. The incoming circuit had two live, one neutral, and one ground. We were concerned that we should split the bundled pair of live wires and connect to each of the incoming live, but the De Dietrich diagram showed that to be a 400V connection and we have 220V.

Using aliceinwonderland's recommendation along with my dad's basic knowledge of how electricity works, we opted to connected the one bundled live pair to an incoming live wire and the bundled neutral pair to the other incoming live wire. The ground was connected back to the incoming ground. We flipped the breaker and voila! All zones started to blink and then the clock showed 12:00.

The installation instructions say to install clips around the perimeter of the cook top, but we did not do that. We measured and realized that once the cook top was dropped into place, the clips would pop open underneath our 3cm granite slab preventing the cooktop to be lifted out. The only way would be to remove the oven underneath to allow us to get underneath the cooktop to remove the tabs. Instead, we placed the foam seal all around the cooktop (per instructions) and dropped it into the hole.

I opened up my new All Clad Stainless pots and pans and roasted some potatoes for dinner. WHAT A PLEASURE IT IS TO USE THIS APPLIANCE! I am absolutely THRILLED with the unit so far.

Installation note: I drilled three holes into the back left/right sides of the cabinet to facilitate additional ventilation. The holes are about 2" in diameter each, and I covered them with a metal mesh material. I had the granite installers leave a vent opening that corresponded with the location of the cooktop vents in the front, so that air could be exhausted behind the 3cm lip of the granite. I ran a bake cycle on my Dacor and it did not create any appreciable heat above the oven unit itself (cool as a cucumber), so I'm hoping heat will not be an issue and that we have secured adequate ventilation.

To everyone on this forum: Upgrade to induction, it's worth it! Get a De Dietrich, it's worth it!


clipped on: 11.24.2006 at 07:50 am    last updated on: 11.24.2006 at 07:51 am

RE: The best Wok for Induction Cooking , found! (Follow-Up #5)

posted by: garycook on 11.20.2006 at 05:55 am in Appliances Forum


Wash real well then coat with cooking oil I use peanut .Then cover the handle with foil,put in the pre heated oven cook at 325 degrees for an hour.That will season your wok.After use on your cooktop be careful not scrape all the carbon material off that's the good thing.
Just wipe down with hot water then oil it inside and out
so the wok won't rust.After a month of use you will see the wok
turn black 70% on the inside.It is this that gives it character and the nonstick surface.

Hope this helped .I have tried them all this is the best for the viking.You can put one of those circular 9" inch round silicone sheets they are 1/32 thick can be bought Bed Bath Beyond .They protect the glass surface and good to 500 degrees don't degrade your power either.The wok weighs six pounds.



seasoning cast iron
clipped on: 11.20.2006 at 07:34 am    last updated on: 11.20.2006 at 07:34 am

RE: price of cambria vs basic granite (Follow-Up #11)

posted by: kompy on 10.05.2006 at 04:02 pm in Kitchens Forum

Here in Midwest:
Cambria (any color, ANY edge) $80-85SF
Caesarstone $55SF to $77SF -Must add for special edges
Zodiaq $68SF to $77- Must add for special edges

Entry level granite: (ie Baltic Brown, Impala Black, Uba Tuba, Verde Butterfly, Tan Brown, Andes Black....) $65SF

Prices include material and setting tops (no tearout, plumbing or electric...must add for that)


counter top prices
clipped on: 11.14.2006 at 08:23 am    last updated on: 11.14.2006 at 08:24 am

RE: Line or Low voltage, xenon or fluorescent undercab lighting (Follow-Up #19)

posted by: mondragon on 11.11.2006 at 09:39 am in Kitchens Forum

I got mine from Fox Electric. They have an awful interface.

What I bought was:

9469-15 White 25 Feet Cable$28.07/EA1 EA$28.07
9435-15 White Track$5.99/EA4 EA$23.96
97119-33 10W Xenon Festoon Frosted Bulb$1.71/EA24 EA$41.04
9460-12 150W Single Output 12V Transformer / Hardwire $73.56/EA2 EA$147.12
9830-15 Lx Linear Lampholder White$3.85/EA18 EA$69.30
9459-15 Lx Miniature Wiring Compartment/Splicer White $8.12/EA6 EA$48.72
9438-15 White Track Clip$1.37/EA20 EA$27.40

I have the lights on two sides (or will, when I install the other side.) The wiring is to a switch on the wall under an upper cabinet that goes to the transformer in the back of a base cabinet. From there it goes up the wall and out right under the bottom of the upper cabinet.

You can get an electronic or a magnetic transformer. From the reading I did at the time I wasn't sure which was best or if it made a difference, but luckily I was buying dimmers at the same time and even though the magnetic transformer was more expensive, the dimmer for the electronic was way more expensive - so based on total cost I got the magnetic.

This isn't a good photo but you get a sense of the balance of the light next to a halogen can over the sink and the cans down the line of the ceiling and the two halogens in the range hood:

This is this morning (we had a big dinner last night):

It will appear darker on PC monitors but if you look at the light outside the windows, that's 8:30am NYC-area south light on a slightly cloudy morning. The light on white cabinets should be slightly bluish; the undercab lights are against a very very pale green wall. The light switches are white. It's a very warm, pleasant light, I think.

Two more views:

I ended up putting them 4" apart on center. Closer than I first thought but I like them that way. They're under two 21in cabinets and there are 10 of them. I haven't put up the light rail yet but you can see at the right of the cabinet how far down the panel comes. The rail won't be as tall as that. It will easily cover the fixtures.

This is the wiring:

It was very easy.

I got them based on people recommendations here and I'm extremely pleased. I don't like harsh light and these are bright but easy on the eyes.


undercabinet lights
clipped on: 11.14.2006 at 08:12 am    last updated on: 11.14.2006 at 08:13 am

RE: Choosing your undercabinet lighting (Follow-Up #6)

posted by: shannonplus2 on 11.12.2006 at 05:21 pm in Kitchens Forum

I have Juno low voltage xenon undercabinet lighting. I have had them for 3 years, and love them. Their light is white and bright and the fixtures do not emit heat (although there have been reports on this forum that there are some xenons that do emit heat, but nothing like the way halogens do). Mine have the transformer separate, but you can buy xenon undercabinet lighting with the transformer built in, which saves money cause the transformer was the most expensive part. Also, I have them on dimmers, which is great for creating soft mood lighting after dinner. Also, mine are placed toward the front of the cabinet, which allows them to shed light on the entire counter, rather than just on the backsplash (if they'd been placed toward the back).

Mariposa, I just can't stand it when electricians or salespeople give misinformation either to sell you something else, or cause they're plain ignorant (".... long term use and how it's going to be hard to find replacement bulbs."). I am glad you knew it was rubbish! One of the advantages of low voltage xenon bulbs is their long lives. I've used my undercab lights almost every day for 3 years, and STILL haven't had to change a bulb yet. And, when I do have to change a bulb, they're readily available at the lighting supply store where I bought the xenon fixtures, or on the internet at numerous websites.


xenen undercabinet lighting
clipped on: 11.14.2006 at 08:04 am    last updated on: 11.14.2006 at 08:04 am

RE: De Detriech induction installation (Follow-Up #3)

posted by: aliceinwonderland_id on 11.11.2006 at 05:13 pm in Appliances Forum

sshrivastava - Here is the wiring diagram I was sent by tech support at Cookpower. It's for the 309, but you just follow the larger circuit and ignore the smaller one. Basically, you take one hot lead from your circuit and tie it to the first 2 live posts on the cooktop (2 and 3 in the diagram). Take your other house hot lead and tie it to the other live post on the cooktop (5 in the diagram). Tie your house neutral to the "Earth" (ground) post on the cooktop. Cap off the house ground. In US circuits, ground and neutral are the same thing, just redundant. They both go to ground. The neutral wire, in most ciruits is a heavier gauge than the ground wire, which is why I prefer to cap the ground and use the neutral, but you can do it either way.


308 installation
clipped on: 11.11.2006 at 05:55 pm    last updated on: 11.11.2006 at 05:55 pm

RE: Floating stainless steel shelving (Follow-Up #6)

posted by: oliverw on 10.15.2006 at 02:07 am in Appliances Forum

The Ikea shelves are 31.5 x 11. I wish they were 30", so I could put them over my range.

Here is a link that might be useful: Ikea Shelves


Grundtal shelf link
clipped on: 11.08.2006 at 06:52 pm    last updated on: 11.08.2006 at 06:53 pm

RE: Woodalls vs Induction (Follow-Up #82)

posted by: sshrivastava on 11.03.2006 at 06:19 pm in Appliances Forum

Mine's in the garage pending granite countertops in the next two weeks, then WEEEEEEEEE!

I'm going to try to cut some horizontal vents into the top and bottom sides of the cabinet as well as the front to hopefully ensure adequate ventilation. I don't want any electronics burning out on me!


Ventilation of the De Dietrich.
clipped on: 11.03.2006 at 06:24 pm    last updated on: 11.03.2006 at 06:25 pm

RE: Please post photos of glass cabinets (Follow-Up #24)

posted by: kompy on 10.04.2006 at 01:18 am in Kitchens Forum

Thanks Hoosiergirl,
Sorry I can't remember what I paid for was more than fluorescent and xenon. How many will you need? I can post back here in the morning when I get back into work. I bought it from Tresco Lighting. See their link below (no pricing on website).

Yeah, I Googled 'cold cathode' too. Doesn't seem to be real popular yet.....found nothing.


ps. I assume you're in Indiana? What part?

Oh yeah, here's another display where we show the cold cathode lights. On this display they are placed horizontally at the BACK of two cabinets. With this, you can see how it looks behind frosted glass (with a darker interior).

Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting

Here is a link that might be useful: Kompy's Cold Cathode Light from Tresco


clipped on: 10.17.2006 at 11:10 am    last updated on: 10.17.2006 at 11:10 am

RE: Please post photos of glass cabinets (Follow-Up #19)

posted by: kompy on 10.03.2006 at 10:25 pm in Kitchens Forum

Love my hutch. I used 'cold cathode lighting' which isn't the warmest of lights....but it'll last for a VERY long time....and it's very I was able to install it at the front of my hutch, behind the front frame, yet still use wood shelves.

Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting

Here's another photo of it at prior to installation, at a home show with the lighting turned on. This is a great light to use behind frosted glass. You can keep them on all the time if you want. They don't get hot.

Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting


clipped on: 10.17.2006 at 11:07 am    last updated on: 10.17.2006 at 11:08 am

RE: Flynmoose & tlangan - eBay or online appliance dealers (Follow-Up #1)

posted by: pecanpie on 09.29.2006 at 09:12 am in Appliances Forum

liz h, I don't know about tacappl on eBay, but we dealt with Saving-U-Money out of Alabama and had a very good experience. We saved a ton and they were lovely to work with. The brick and mortar store is Fredrickson's Appliances, I believe.

Some on this forum have purchased from Gochenaur (sp?) but we had a bad experience and cannot recommend them.

We also purchased (via eBay) a display model warming drawer from a family-owned appliance store in NC, Subzero freezer drawers from a gentleman in Illinois who decided he'd rather move in with his girlfriend than finish his kitchen remodel (I assume he was attracted to her kitchen...) and all our faucets/sinks/garbage disposals from various and assorted individuals.

I don't think Cuttingedgeappliances lists on eBay, but their clearance items are rock bottom and their shipping is unbeatable. We got our icemaker from them- a courier brought it to our door, unloaded it, we inspected it and he packaged it back up and brought it inside! Can't beat that with a stick.


clipped on: 10.01.2006 at 07:18 am    last updated on: 10.01.2006 at 07:19 am

RE: What's underneath your induction? (Follow-Up #1)

posted by: gbk1 on 04.26.2006 at 12:04 pm in Appliances Forum

We have a 30" De Dietrich DTI308X mounted over a Fisher & Paykel 302 Aerotech oven. Multiple forum posters have installed their Diva/De Dietrich/Brandt 4 zone cooktops over drawers, let alone ovens without incident. we frequently operate our DTI308X while running the F&P on Maxi Broil, its hottest setting

The comparable Diva de Provence model is the DPP-4. With the recent upgrade by Diva to a full 7200 watt specification, I would assume that the two units are now virtually identical. Dimensionally, they *are* identical. Divas thickness spec "includes clearance underneath of 50mm [2.0"]" which is the same as De Dietrichs 5 cm. clearance. Subtracting 50 mm from the Diva spec of 142 mm gives 92 mm (Divas :cooktop box size" thickness), from which should be subtracted Divas "cooktop rim size" thickness of 10 mm, bringing us to 82 mm. De Dietrich indicates a thickness below the rim of 5.9 cm (59 mm) but this doesnt include the air intake molding on the bottom of the unit which protrudes downwards a little less than an inch, accounting for the 23 mm difference. Both brands allow the air intake molding to protrude downwards into the 50 mm venting space. None of this should be surprising since both units are essentially the same Fagor-Brandt manufactured model marketed and sold under two different brands.

If there is a critical issue its proper internal venting of the cabinet as illustrated below (from the FTI308X manual). In our own installation (over an oven), we did not include the tiny 4 mm slot in the front, since neighboring cracks around cabinet drawers provided more than ample venting. We did, however, include the 8 cm x 5 cm openings in the sides of the cabinet box. Without an oven, the installation is even less sensitive to ventilation issues.

Bottom line your KD is just plain wrong in this regard. Dont deny yourself the extra storage space in fact such a drawer is ideal for the cooking utensils you'll use while operating your new induction cooktop!

Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting


clipped on: 06.07.2006 at 07:44 pm    last updated on: 06.07.2006 at 07:44 pm

RE: Dishdrawer installation method -poll and problem (Follow-Up #1)

posted by: rfinley69 on 06.07.2006 at 02:59 pm in Appliances Forum

I looked at the rubber "Y" thing for the two drain hoses...muttered "yeah, I'd rather shoot myself in the head" and threw it away.

Went to my big-box hardware store, picked up a brass "Y" fitting for garden hoses (the only one I could find) and two brass "nipples" intended to make custom-length garden hoses sized for the black corrugated pipe. The connection to the air gap and the sink drain was larger as you have to use a pipe size that fits the air gap.

Drain problem solved (air gap kept leaking until I figured out I had it installed backwards. sigh)

Leaking dishwashers rarely dump water towards the front where you can see it. They would rather drip towards the back wall so you have to wait until smelly mold starts growing.

First covered the floor, rear wall, and up the sides of the cabinet opening with a single piece of rubber shower membrane to redirect the water towards the front. Shaped it by folding the corners like a bedsheet. Covered the floor area of the membrane with a sheet of plywood cut to protect it from the dishwasher feet.

In the case of the dishdrawers, installation is complex as you can't just fasten the sides of the box to the surrounding cabinets. You have to attach the small metal brackets to the floor (cement foundation in my case, hence the plywood) that the leveler feet slide into. You will need to level the unit and check its overall height before you try to slide it under the cabinet.

You must have a way of attaching the top of the DishDrawer box mounting tabs to the underside of the countertop. A length of 2x4" and some liquid-nails worked for me over the past 7 years. Bent the tabs straight up and covered them with a piece of wood cut to fill the gap.

Follow the F&P instructions carefully. Use the template.

I've had mine since '00. I'll buy another F&P if it ever croaks.


FP disdrawers installation
clipped on: 06.07.2006 at 05:20 pm    last updated on: 06.07.2006 at 05:21 pm