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RE: Show us your 'under $20K' kitchens! (Follow-Up #87)

posted by: david123 on 12.31.2008 at 01:47 pm in Kitchens Forum

So, can I include mine here, even though it came to 23-24 K? What if I don't count the refrig? We were getting a new one anyway?!?! :-)

This thread is great- I might use the idea with the blackboard and magnet board that I saw on one of the pictures in my basement bar area! Neat idea! I keep looking at all the pics and thinking of things I should have done, or could still do, etc.

Happy New Year everyone!

Here is a link that might be useful: DIY Dream Kitchen Blog


great tile on the back splash
clipped on: 01.01.2009 at 11:58 am    last updated on: 01.01.2009 at 11:59 am

RE: Deglosser vs. Sanding Kitchen Cabinets (Follow-Up #7)

posted by: igloochic on 08.01.2008 at 01:01 pm in Kitchens Forum

OK DON'T use deglosser. Instead, use Sherwin Williams PrepRite ProBlock Interior Exterior Seals and Bonds, Latex primer (be sure you get exactly that says BONDS on the label). It's made to cover shiny surfaces and bond tightly, and I've used it in several kitchens, and on all of my interior woodwork and it does BOND!! No sanding, just wipe down your cabinets with either a TSP and water mixture or a little vinager and water to get rid of grease.

This stuff is wonderful. I've converted many naysayers to the primer because you really don't have to sand or use a deglosser, and even if they're will BOND and you'll have a finish you can then paint on. :O) It's so much easier. I just love it (I just picked up another couple of gallons last night). And the finish will be tough as nails by the way. I personally also like to use a high quality sherwin williams paint.

THis is the base for a dark color:
Sherwin Williams All Surface Glass Enamel
Acrylic Latex HIGH GLOSS Ultradeep base 6403-25932

If you're painting white, just ask for the same thing in a white base.


a good one on painting and priming!
clipped on: 08.03.2008 at 11:53 pm    last updated on: 08.03.2008 at 11:53 pm

Stone Information and Advice (& Checklists)

posted by: buehl on 04.14.2008 at 02:56 am in Kitchens Forum

First off, I want to give a big thank-you to StoneGirl, Kevin, Joshua, Mimi, and others (past and current) on this forum who have given us many words of wisdom concerning stone countertops.

I've tried to compile everything I saved over the past 8 months that I've been on this Forum. Most of it was taken from a write-up by StoneGirl (Natural stone primer/granite 101); other threads and sources were used as well.

So...if the experts could review the information I've compiled below and send me comments (here or via email), I will talk to StarPooh about getting this on the FAQ.

Stone Information, Advice, and Checklists:

In an industry that has no set standards, there are many unscrupulous people trying to palm themselves off as fabricators. There are also a number of people with odd agendas trying to spread ill rumors about natural stone and propagate some very confusing and contradictory information. This is my small attempt at shedding a little light on the subject.

Slab Selection:

On the selection of the actual stone slabs - When you go to the slab yard to choose slabs for your kitchen, there are a few things you need to take note of:

  • Surface finish: The finish - be it polished, honed, flamed antiqued, or brushed, should be even. There should be no spots that have obvious machine marks, scratches, or other man made marks. You can judge by the crystal and vein pattern of the stone if the marks you see are man-made or naturally occurring. It is true that not all minerals will finish evenly and if you look at an angle on a polished slab with a larger crystal pattern, you can clearly see this. Tropic Brown would be a good example here. The black spots will not polish near as shiny as the brown ones and this will be very obvious on an unresined slab when looking at an acute angle against the light. The black specks will show as duller marks. The slab will feel smooth and appear shiny if seen from above, though. This effect will not be as pronounced on a resined slab.

    Bottom line when judging the quality of a surface finish: Look for unnatural appearing marks. If there are any on the face of the slab, it is not desirable. They might well be on the extreme edges, but this is normal and a result of the slab manufacturing process.

  • Mesh backing: Some slabs have a mesh backing. This was done at the plant where the slabs were finished. This backing adds support to brittle materials or materials with excessive veining or fissures. A number of exotic stones will have this. This does not necessarily make the material one of inferior quality, though. Quite often, these slabs will require special care in fabrication and transport, so be prepared for the fabricator to charge accordingly. If you are unsure about the slabs, ask your fabricator what his opinion of the material is.

  • Cracks and fissures: Yes - some slabs might have them. One could have quite the discussion on whether that line on the slab could be one or the other, so I'll try to explain it a little.

    • Fissures are naturally occurring features in stone. They will appear as little lines in the surface of the slabs (very visible in a material like Verde Peacock) and could even be of a different color than the majority of the stone (think of those crazed white lines sometimes appearing in Antique Brown). Sometimes they could be fused like in Antique Brown and other times they could be open, as is the case in the Verde Peacock example. They could often also go right through the body of the slab like in Crema Marfil, for instance. If you look at the light reflection across a fissure, you will never see a break - i.e., there will be no change in the plane on either side of a fissure.

    • A crack on the other hand is a problem... If you look at the slab at an oblique angle in the light, you will note the reflection of the shine on the surface of the stone. A crack will appear as a definite line through the reflection and the reflection will have a different appearance on either side of the line - there will be a break in the plane. Reject slabs like this. One could still work around fissures. Cracks are a whole other can of worms.

    • Resined slabs: The resin gets applied prior to the slabs being polished. Most of the resin then gets ground off in the polishing process. You should not be able to see just by looking at the surface of a slab whether it was resined or not. If you look at the rough sides of the slab, though, you will see some drippy shiny marks, almost like varnish drips. This should be the only indication that the slab is resined. There should never be a film or layer on the face of the stone. With extremely porous stones, the resining will alleviate, but not totally eliminate absorption issues and sealer could still be required. Lady's dream is an example. This material is always resined, but still absorbs liquids and requires sealer.

    • Test the material you have selected for absorption issues regardless - it is always best to know what your stone is capable of and to be prepared for any issues that might arise. Some stones indeed do not require sealer - be they resined or not. Baltic Brown would be an example here. It will not absorb one iota of anything, but it is still resined to eliminate a flaking issue.

Tests (especially for Absolute Black) (using a sample of YOUR slab):

  • To verify you have true AB and not dyed: Clean with denatured alcohol and rub marble polishing powder on the face. (Get denatured alcohol at Home Depot in the paint department)

  • Lemon Juice or better yet some Muratic Acid: will quickly show if the stone has alot of calcium content and will end up getting etched. This is usually chinese stone, not indian.

  • Acetone: The Dying usually is done on the same chinese stone. like the others said, acetone on a rag will reveal any dye that has been applied

  • Chips: Using something very hard & metalhit the granite sharply & hard on edges to see if it chips, breaks, or cracks


  • Before the templaters get there...
    • Make sure you have a pretty good idea of your faucet layout--where you want the holes drilled for all the fixtures and do a test mock up to make sure you have accounted for sufficient clearances between each fixture.

    • Be sure you test your faucet for clearances not just between each fixture, but also between the faucet and the wall behind the faucet (if there is one). You need to be sure the handle will function properly.

    • Make sure that the cabinets are totally level (not out by more than 1/8") before the counter installers come in.

    • Check how close they should come to a stove and make sure the stove sits up higher than the counter.

    • Make sure they have the sink/faucet templates to work from.

    • Make sure have your garbage disposal air switch on hand or know the diameter

  • If you are not putting in a backsplash, tell them

  • Double check the template. Make sure that the measurements are reasonable. Measure the opening for the range.

  • Seam Placement: Yet another kettle of fish (or can of worms, depending on how you look at it, I guess!) Seam placement is ultimately at the discretion of the fabricator. I know it is not a really popular point of view, but that is just the way it is. There really is more to deciding where the seam would go than just the size of the slab or where the seam would look best in the kitchen.

    Most stone installations will have seams. They are unavoidable in medium or large sized kitchens. One hallmark of a good fabricator is that they will keep the seams to a minimum. It seems that a good book could be written about seams, their quality, and their placementand still you will have some information that will be omitted! For something as seemingly simple as joining two pieces of stone, seams have evolved into their own universe of complexity far beyond what anybody should have fair cause to expect!

  • Factors determining seam placement:

    • The slab: size, color, veining, structure (fissures, strength of the material an other characteristics of the stone)

    • Transport to the job site: Will the fabricated pieces fit on whatever vehicle and A-frames he has available

    • Access to the job site: Is the house on stilts? (common in coastal areas) How will the installers get the pieces to where they need to go? Will the tops fit in the service elevator if the apartment is on the 10th floor? Do the installers need to turn tight corners to get to the kitchen? There could be 101 factors that will influence seam placement here alone.

    • Placement and size of undermount (or other) cut-outs. Some fabricators like to put seams in undermount sinks, some do not. We, for instance will do it if absolutely necessary, and have done so with great success, but will not do so as general practice. We do like to put seams in the middle of drop-in appliances and cut-outs and this is a great choice for appearances and ease of installation.

    • Location of the cabinets: Do the pieces need to go in between tall cabinets with finished sides? Do the pieces need to slide in under appliance garages or other cabinetry? How far do the upper cabinets hang over? Is there enough clearance between the vent hood and other cabinets? Again the possibilities are endless and would depend on each individual kitchen lay-out and - ultimately -

    • Install-ability of the fabricated pieces: Will that odd angle hold up to being moved and turned around to get on the peninsula if there is no seam in it? Will the extra large sink cut-out stay intact if we hold the piece flat and at a 45 degree angle to slide it in between those two tall towers? Again, 1,001 combinations of cabinetry and material choices will come into play on this question.

    You can ask your fabricator to put a seam at a certain location and most likely he will oblige, but if he disagrees with you, it is not (always) out of spite or laziness. Check on your fabricator's seams by going to actual kitchens he has installed. Do not trust what you see in a showroom as sole testament to your fabricator's ability to do seams.

    With modern glues and seaming methods, a seam could successfully be put anywhere in an installation without compromising the strength or integrity of the stone. If a seam is done well, there is - in theory - no "wrong" location for it. A reputable fabricator will also try to keep the number of seams in any installation to a minimum. It is not acceptable, for instance to have a seam in each corner, or at each point where the counter changes direction, like on an angled peninsula.

    Long or unusually large pieces are often done if they can fit in the constraints of a slab. Slabs as a rule of thumb will average at about 110"x65". There are bigger slabs and quite often smaller ones too. Check with the fabricator or the slab yard. They will be more than happy to tell you the different sizes of slabs they have available. Note, though, that the larger the slabs, the smaller the selection of possible colors. Slab sizes would depend in part on the capabilities of the quarry, integrity of the material or the capabilities of the machinery at the finishing plant. We have had slabs as wide as 75" and as long as 130" before, but those are monsters and not always readily available.

  • Generally, it is not a good idea to seam over a DW because there's no support for the granite, and anything heavy placed at or near the seam would stress the stone, possibly breaking it.

  • Rodding is another issue where a tremendous amount of mis-information and scary stories exist: The main purpose for rodding stone would be to add integrity to the material around cut-outs. This is primarily for transport and installation and serves no real purpose once the stone is secured and fully supported on the cabinets. It would also depend on the material. A fabricator would be more likely to rod Ubatuba than he would Black Galaxy, for instance. The flaky and delicate materials prone to fissures would be prime candidates for rodding. Rodding is basically when a fabricator cuts slots in the back of the stone and embeds steel or fiberglass rods with epoxy in the slots in the stone. You will not see this from the top or front of the installation. This is an "insurance policy" created by the fabricator to make sure that the stone tops make it to your cabinets all in one piece

  • Edges: The more rounded an edge is, the more stable it would be. Sharp, flat edges are prone to chipping under the right (or rather wrong) circumstances. Demi or full bullnose edges would almost entirely eliminate this issue. A properly milled and polished edge will be stable and durable regardless of the profile, though. My guess at why ogee and stacked edges are not more prevalent would be purely because of cost considerations. Edge pricing is determined by the amount of work needed to create it. The more intricate edge profiles also require an exponentially larger skill set and more time to perfect. The ogee edge is a very elegant edge and can be used to great effect, but could easily look overdone if it is used everywhere. We often advise our clients to combine edges for greater impact - i.e., eased edge on all work surfaces, and ogee on the island to emphasize the cabinetry or unusual shape.
    Edge profiles are largely dependent on what you like and can afford. There is no real pro or con for regular or laminated edges. They all have their place in the design world. Check with your fabricator what their capabilities and pricing are. Look at actual kitchens and ask for references.


  • Seams:
    One hallmark of a good fabricator is that they will keep the seams to a minimum [StoneGirl]

    • A generic good quality seam should have the following characteristics:
      • It should be flat. According to the Marble Institute of America (MIA) a minimal amount of lippage is acceptable (1/32"), but conscientious fabricators all strive for a perfectly flat and smooth joint.

      • It should be narrow - as in smaller than 1/16". (I think the MIA stipulates no larger than 1/8", but that is pushing it - and only if the fabricator bevels the edges of the seam, almost similar to the edge of a stone tile. This is, thank goodness, not a standard practice any more!)

      • The color on either side of the seam should match as closely as possible. On regularly patterned stones like Ubatuba for example - there should be no variation. On stones with variation in colors or veins, the match should be made as close as was humanly possible.

      • Vein direction should flow. The MIA suggests a single direction of vein flow, but it is acceptable IF DISCUSSED WITH THE CLIENT to change vein direction on a seam if no other option is available. This would happen in book matched slabs - you will have a "butterfly" seam in this case. In other cases, the fabricator could put a miter seam in a corner and change vein direction 90 degrees. This is usually done with extremely linear veining like Bamboo Green, for example, but this is something that should be discussed with the fabricator and agreed upon by the client.

      • The seam on the finished edge of the stone should NOT dip in and create a divot in the edge. When you run your fingers over the edge, you should not be able to feel the location of the seam at all.

      • The thickness of the slabs on either side of the seam should be equal (or feathered out so that there is no discernible difference)

      • The glue in the seam should be of a color that matches the stone as closely as possible. Glue joints that are too light or too dark will show up something terrible. The idea behind tinting the glue is to try to make the seam "disappear" or something relatively close to it

  • Checklist:
    • Check the seams for evenness and smoothness.

      • Make sure that the seams are neat and clean.

      • Make sure that the seams are not obvious.

      • Make sure the seams are butted tight

      • Make sure that there are no scratches, pits, or cracks

    • If sealing is necessary (not all granites need to be sealed):

      • Make sure that the granite has been sealed

      • If more than one application of sealer was applied, ask how long they waited between applications

      • Ask which sealer has been used on the granite.

    • Make sure the sink reveal is consistent all the away around

    • Check the gap of the granite at the wall junctions.

    • Check for inconsistent overhangs from the counter edges

    • Check for chips. These can be filled.

    • Make sure the top drawers open & close

    • Make sure that you can open & close your dishwasher

    • Make sure the stove sits up higher than the counter

    • Make sure that you have the appropriate clearances for your appliances

    • Check the edge all around, a good edge should have the following characteristics:
      • Shine: The edge polish should match the top polish in depth and clarity. The edge should not be milky, dull, or waxy.

      • The edge should not have "waves". Eyeball along the edge. A good edge should have a mirror like reflection and be fairly flat. Waves that you can see or feel are not a good thing.

      • The aris (very top of the edge) should be crisp and straight, even on a bullnose edge. Once again you can see this by eyeballing along the very top end of the edge profile. A wavy, dippy aris is poor craftsmanship.

      • A good edge will have a consistent profile. It will not be larger in some spots or smaller in others.

      • A good edge should also have NO tooling lines. These will be fine lighter/white lines running along the edge. This is a mark of a poor edge polish, of a CNC machine that is not set correctly, and a lack of hand finishing. This is common when a company has only mechanical fabrication (i.e., CNC machines or line polishers) and no skilled hand fabricators to finish the work properly.

    • Run your hands around the entire laminated edge of yor counters to make sure they are smooth

    • Check surrounding walls & cabinets for damage

Miscellaneous Information:

  • More than all the above and below, though, is to be present for both the templating as well as having the templates placed on your slabs at the fabricator's
    If you canot be there, then have a lengthy conversation about seam placement, ways to match the movement, and ways to color-match the counters that will be joined at the seam

  • Find a fabricator who is a member of the SFA

  • When they polish your stone for you don't let them wax it. It will look terrible in 2 months when the wax wears off.

  • Don't use the Magic Eraser on granite--especially AB

  • Any slab with more fill (resin) than stone is certainly a no-no!!

  • When you do check for scratches, have overhead lighting shining down so scratches are easier to see

  • Don't let them do cutouts in place (granite dust becomes a major issue)

  • Granite dust can be a problem...some have heard of SS appliances & hoods damaged by the dust, others have heard of drawer glides being ruined by the dust

  • If you have wood floors--especially if you're in the process of staining or finishing them--make sure that they don't spill or drip granite sealer on the wood floors. Apparently the sealer interferes with the stain or finish process.

  • Suggested Prep for Installation:
    • Remove any drawers and pullouts beneath any sections that will be cut or drilled onsite, e.g., sink cutouts and/or faucet, soap dispenser, air gap, instant hot etc. holes, cooktop cutouts.

    • Then just cover the glides themselves with a few layers of blue painter's tape (or some combo of plastic wrap and tape)

    • If you make sure to cover the top of the glides and attach some of the tape to the cab wall as well (to form sort of a seal)and cover the rest of the glides completely with tape, you should be fine.

    • Usually the fabricators will have someone holding a vacuum hose right at the spot where they are drilling or cutting, so very little granite dust should be landing on the glides. What little dust escapes the vacuum will be blocked by the layer(s) of tape.

    • When done w/installation, remove the tape and use a DustBuster (or similar) on all the cabinets and glides

  • Countertop Support:

    • If your granite is 2 cm thick, then there can be no more then 6" of of unsupported span with a 5/8" subtop

    • If your granite is 3 cm thick, then there can be no more then 10" of unsupported span - no subtop required

    • If you need support, the to determine your corbel dimensions:

    • Thickness of Stone - Dimension of Unsupported Span = Corbel Dimensino

    • i.e., an 18" total overhang in 2 cm would require a 12" corbe; the same overhang in 3 cm would require an 8" corbel


clipped on: 04.17.2008 at 10:18 pm    last updated on: 04.17.2008 at 10:19 pm

RE: Good source for decorative thick island legs (Follow-Up #4)

posted by: ci_lantro on 04.16.2008 at 08:34 am in Kitchens Forum

There was a thread on this within the last 2-3 months with lots of good info on multiple sources. Can't find it now but it went something like...Show Me Your (Thick) Legs. Anyhoo, here's a link to VanDykes.

Here is a link that might be useful: VanDykes


clipped on: 04.16.2008 at 09:29 am    last updated on: 04.16.2008 at 09:29 am

RE: Shaker Style Cabinets Anyone? (Follow-Up #21)

posted by: zelmar on 04.01.2008 at 11:12 am in Kitchens Forum

Hi fern4, Here's a close up:



zelmar's close up.
clipped on: 04.01.2008 at 12:37 pm    last updated on: 04.01.2008 at 12:38 pm

RE: Shaker Style Cabinets Anyone? (Follow-Up #17)

posted by: zelmar on 03.31.2008 at 12:38 pm in Kitchens Forum

Ours are close to Shaker-style....with a few extras. Rather than plain inset, they are beaded inset. And rather than having a plain flat panel--we added a quarter round molding piece around the panel. We have the Shaker-style flat panels in our bathroom and I find that the flat ledge (created by the panel) is a great collector of fine air-borne matter and I'm too messy with flour. Also, the hardware is more Victorian. (and yes, the crown molding and legs are too fancy too...ok, maybe not Shaker at all, but I think it has the "feel" of Shaker, sort of.)



zelmar states, "Ours are close to Shaker-style....with a few extras. Rather than plain inset, they are beaded inset." see close up, next clipping
clipped on: 04.01.2008 at 12:35 pm    last updated on: 04.01.2008 at 12:36 pm

RE: Relative cabinetry prices: brand vs. brand (Follow-Up #4)

posted by: afr66 on 03.29.2008 at 01:26 pm in Kitchens Forum

Prices vary a lot depending on where you are purchasing. In my case I priced out 4 different lines -- all from lumber yards/kitchen places (as opposed to HD or Lowes). These are all semi-custom lines. Omega Dynasty was most expensive ($20,000), Brookhaven 2d ($18,000), Candlelight ($16,000) and Showplace (the one I'm going with ) $13,000.
The one caveat is that if you want INSET doors (usually only available with custom), I'd recommend Candlelight. They have a gorgeous product, but when we had to cut our budget, I switched to Showplace (also very nice, but no inset doors - just full overlay).
I would shop around beyond just HD or Lowe's -- many lumberyards/hardware places also sell cabinets and these are often comparably priced for a little bit better quality.


Candlelight cabinets-inset doors
clipped on: 03.29.2008 at 08:58 pm    last updated on: 03.29.2008 at 08:59 pm

RE: Igloochick - question on your hinges/knobs (Follow-Up #1)

posted by: igloochic on 03.25.2008 at 09:38 pm in Kitchens Forum

Heh heh, I love knobs...did you know I love knobs? Heh heh (anyone on the forum for over a year knows I'm a knob freak LOL)

I went with Omega Custom, with a beaded inset door, with concealed hinges. I needed to have a concealed hinge because I am a knob freak and actually picked the cabinets to go with the knobs, verses the knobs to go with the cabinets heh heh My door isn't on the omega website, but it's a simple shaker style (Manheim I think) with a beaded inset door. I wanted to show you some inset doors without hinges so you can get a feel for them (since mine are in the warehouse) so (sorry for the links, visit these). I like that they hinge isn't seen. My knobs are busy and they're the stars...I don't want a hinge to busy up the works even more.

We went with a natural cherry with an autum finish (just evens out the cherry a bit). The uppers are all glass front (in a gold tone glass I found at a stained glass store with a bit of a ripple so you can't see my cans of soup).

My kitchen has both gold tone and silver tone fixtures. The lighting is antique art's one in all gold:
Mine have silver bodies and the arms that hold the glass are gold as well as a couple accent places, so that allowed me to use both tones in the kitchen. The stove (Lacanche) also has brass and chrome knobs and so does the Franke Pot filler.

So here are the knobs:

The twisted (plain...well for me) knob in the back is the main knob in the kitchen. It will be on the majority of the cabinets, but the animals will be scattered throughout as well :) There are a couple that might not make it into the mix (the bunnies with bows most likely) even though they're not as bright as they look here (flash) they still are a bit domestic in comparison with the rest.

I'm using a granite I never see anywhere called Vulcan Gold. (I purchased this two years ago before marble was in fashion LOL) But I still love it. The tile is the backsplash:

The walls will be venetian plaster in a soft gold to compliment the balance of the kitchen, and the floors are a dark walnut (stained oak). One of the counter tops (the sink run and around the stove, will be stainless in a brushed pattern. This is the work horse of the kitchen (where DH...the work horse likes to work) with a built in drain to the sink and low marine edges so it's easy to keep spills contained (he's a sloppy cook).

Then behind the stove I have this:

The sinks and appliances are stainless aside from the stove which is black enamel (I don't like them hidden..I don't want to be drunk and not find the fridge) :oP

And here's how the entire kitchen looks now:
It's framed in nordic black antique granite and that's also used on the massive hood above the stove (it's 55" or so long).

Gosh I hope yours looks better :oP (Those are just the guts...that is the "formal" living room..can't ya tell?)

I sure hope I can post pictures before I collect social security...or my two year old learns to drive....


great ideas collected by igloo chick!
clipped on: 03.26.2008 at 02:52 pm    last updated on: 03.26.2008 at 02:53 pm

RE: Lower than standard height countertop (Follow-Up #9)

posted by: chefkev on 03.15.2008 at 11:22 pm in Kitchens Forum

I'm not an expert, however everyone in my little family is on the short side so I am having 3/4 inch shaved off my 4 1/2" toe kick for final height of 35 1/4". My contractor advised not taking any more off the toekick. My understanding is a standard base cab with toe kick is is 34 1/2" high and the standard counter is 1 1/2" high for a standard height of 36". Many cabinet makers make their cabinets in 3" increments. If yours makes a 27" base cab, you could attach a 4 1/2" toe kick and standard counter which could give you a 33" height. If you went with a 5" toe kick it would get you up to 33 1/2". I'm not sure at what height a toe kick becomes weird looking. Hope this helps.


cabinet height for bake center?
clipped on: 03.18.2008 at 12:09 am    last updated on: 03.18.2008 at 12:09 am

RE: Plywood or particle board boxes on your kitchen cabs? (Follow-Up #14)

posted by: oskiebabu on 03.07.2008 at 09:29 am in Kitchens Forum

IKEA maniacs like how inexpensive it is in comparison to many other cabinets and have bought into the IKEA-madness. Having seen them and how they are made they should be inexpensive. If you plan on selling your house soon IKEA could be fine. But if you want good quality cabinetry that will last, it isn't a great line.

Great lines, such as AristoKraft, Wood-Mode, Omega, are some of the best. I've seen some Canac Cellini cabinets and they are very well made frameless and they also have both modern and conventional designs. The Canac Cellini in Bird's Eye Maple with a honey color is simply gorgeous. It is fairly expensive, but their are cheaper finishes. There are a vast number of manufacturers and one should read how they are made, as "bemorepanic" says above.

Obviously your budget will mostly determine the quality of the product. This isn't to say that there aren't some very well made medium-priced cabinets---there are.



cabinet lines
clipped on: 03.07.2008 at 09:44 am    last updated on: 03.07.2008 at 09:44 am

RE: Plywood or particle board boxes on your kitchen cabs? (Follow-Up #6)

posted by: ccc123 on 03.06.2008 at 08:28 pm in Kitchens Forum

Our cabinet maker used 'Medtite 2' to build our cabinet boxes because it has no formaldehyde. You can use any veneer or finish on it.

For our underlay, under our countertops, we specified the brand 'PureBond' plywood. No formaldehyde, no outgassing, no voc's, no smell. You can google PureBond for more info.

Kitchen & bath cabinetry are the largest sources of formaldehyde in a home. There are many innovative products on the market that are easy to find. Try to avoid all products with formaldehyde; it is a carcinogen and causes cancer.

Better for the environment & healthier indoor air quality for you & your family.

Helpful website -


clipped on: 03.07.2008 at 09:39 am    last updated on: 03.07.2008 at 09:39 am

RE: Pirula: about your gorgeous kitchen (Follow-Up #6)

posted by: pirula on 01.24.2008 at 06:58 pm in Kitchens Forum

gosh thanks Holly!!

I have a Russel Hobbs toaster, does it count? LOL!

Be very VERY careful with the F&B paint chips. Basically, they suck. You absolutely have to get a sample can and make big swatches of your color choices. There is something about this paint that just doesn't translate to a chip, even one made of the paint itself. Trust me, 80 percent of my house is F&B, I know. You will love the White Tie. It is exquisite, a true cream. With not hint of yellow or pink. At least in our light here in Virginia. Let's see what it does where you are.

rmkitchen: Here's a link to the kitch picks in photobucket. Stupid Yahoo stopped pictures. Unfortunately, I only have a few pics here, but you'll get the general idea.

Here is a link that might be useful: Kitchen


pirula kitchen-the cabinets!!
clipped on: 01.24.2008 at 10:43 pm    last updated on: 02.29.2008 at 01:22 pm

Finished (for now) kitchen photos - modern victorian

posted by: mrslimestone on 02.24.2008 at 12:46 am in Kitchens Forum

I posted my soapstone photos a few weeks ago but Im finally getting around to posting finished* photos. (*I'm not truly finished as I still have to get glass shelves made for the upper cabinets, get a window treatment and put in that missing lightbulb but lets call it finished for now)

Finished kitchen
Finished kitchen

Thanks everyone for tremendous resource this board has been! Its so helpful to have a panel of experts there 24/7 at the ready.

Here are all the specs
Cabinets: Plain & Fancy, Kent Door, Buttercream Color
Appliances: GE Cafe Microwave, Range & Dishwasher, GE Profile French Door Fridge
Countertop: Black Venata Soapstone from MTex
Backsplash: Vintage Subway tiles from repurposed from original bath elsewhere in my house
Pendant Lights: Hinkley Knickerbocker
Undercabinet/In Cabinet Lights: LED ewCove 12 in strips
Sink: Shaw Fireclay
Faucet: Rohl Country Bridge in Polished Nicel
Paint on wall: Woodland Snow by Benjamin Moore (flat)
Paint on trim: Bone White by Benjamin Moore (Semi)
Paint on Ceiling: China White (flat)


love the cabinets, the SOAPstone is grand!
clipped on: 02.29.2008 at 12:40 pm    last updated on: 02.29.2008 at 12:41 pm

RE: pantry shelf depth? (Follow-Up #3)

posted by: buehl on 01.26.2008 at 07:04 pm in Kitchens Forum

I think this is it:

The pantry measures 4 feet wide by 5 feet deep.
Starting at the top:

18" top shelf to ceiling(Things I don't need often or are lightweight.)
15" to next shelf (cereal boxes, etc.)
10" to next (canned goods, etc.)
10" to next (canned goods, etc.)
16" to next (small appliances)
20" from bottom shelf to floor (extra waters, heavy items)

The depth of the back shelf and the right side 12". The left side is 6" and holds hot sauces and other small items.


clipped on: 01.27.2008 at 06:21 pm    last updated on: 01.27.2008 at 06:22 pm

RE: Pirula: about your gorgeous kitchen (Follow-Up #2)

posted by: pirula on 01.24.2008 at 03:47 pm in Kitchens Forum

Hi holly and starpooh!

OMG you have made my day. Can I just tell you what a S**T day I have had? And now it's all better......

I'd be delighted to be in the FKB, what do you need? I'm not sure why it never happened. Heaven knows I've been here long enough! ha ha!

Okay holly your questions:

Yes. I used F&B paint in the kitchen on the walls and the paneling in the bookcase. It is fantastic paint. The walls "White Tie" in eggshell. The trim and ceiling are "Pointing" and the back of the bookcase is "Matchstick". This stuff cleans up like a dream. The cabinets are not F&B they're an FPE paint with a number for the color. I can look it up if you're interested. It's very close to the "White Tie" but ever so slightly different. Only I seem to notice it. And it's even better paint, if you can believe that. The cabinets get ALOT of wear and tear and scrubbing, and let me tell you, they're like new. They've even survived the puppy (enough said).

The tongue and groove paneling is separate pieces, 5" wide. I have had two of the planks sort of separate slightly this winter, but it's barely noticeable and just not a big deal at all to me.

THe open shelves are not at all hard to clean since they're not very high given the 8ft 3in ceilings and that wonder of modern homekeeping: the swiffer. I only keep stuff up there that I use all the time. And I have a really good hood. I haven't had any grease issues. The few decorative things up there just get dusted twice a week and it's fine.

Thank you again for the wonderful compliment!



clipped on: 01.24.2008 at 10:44 pm    last updated on: 01.24.2008 at 10:44 pm

RE: Curious about text in messages (Follow-Up #29)

posted by: starpooh on 01.24.2008 at 12:05 pm in Kitchens Forum

I downloaded a version of "cod-o matik" but couldn't get it to run. So I searched around for an online version and came up with this:
Easy HTML Tag Generator.
It's a WYSIWYG editor ("What You See Is What You Get") that allows you to easily generate html code. It's used on many websites these days (including the Forum FAQ site), so it may be advantageous to learn!

There are alot of fancy things it can do, but these are the basics:
1. Type your text
2. Highlight an area of text and select an appropriate button:

  • Bold text: Click the bold B button. Click again to turn off.
  • Italic text: Click the italics I button. Click again to turn off.
  • Colored text: Click the downward arrow to the right of the large A. Select a color.
  • Highlight Background text: Click the downward arrow to the right of the highlighter with the yellow "ab". Select a color.
3. To view the html: Click the HTML button
4. Copy and paste the html into your forum post.

Give it a try! It's fun to "play" with!

Here is a link that might be useful: Easy HTML Tag Generator


clipped on: 01.24.2008 at 10:34 pm    last updated on: 01.24.2008 at 10:34 pm

RE: Curious about text in messages (Follow-Up #34)

posted by: plllog on 01.24.2008 at 02:17 pm in Kitchens Forum

Debi, It's unordered list. Everything with a bullet gets it's own list item code:

<li>item 1</li>
<li>item 2</li>
<li>item 3</li>
<li>item 4</li>


  • item 1

  • item 2

  • item 3

  • item 4


clipped on: 01.24.2008 at 10:32 pm    last updated on: 01.24.2008 at 10:32 pm

RE: Curious about text in messages (Follow-Up #2)

posted by: buehl on 01.23.2008 at 05:33 pm in Kitchens Forum

LOL! It took me a while to figure it out as 13-yo son told me how.

You user HTML codes surrounded by angle brackets (< and >)

You put a "beginning" code where you want the format (Underline, etc.) to start and an "ending" code where you want it to end. The "ending code is the same as the beginning code except you precede it by a slash (/)

Some Codes are:

Bold: strong
Underline: u
Italic: i
Superscript: sup

The following are included in the "font" code:
Color: color = "name of the color, e.g., red, blue, etc.
Font: face = "name of the font e.g., arial"
Size: size = "how much smaller/bigger than normal e.g, -1, +2"

Some examples. Note: take out the space between the bracket and the code. I had to put them in so it would show up instead of using the code!

< strong>Bold< /strong> you...Bold
< u>Underline< /u> you...Underline
< i>Italic< /i> you...Italic
< font color = "blue">Blue< /font> you...Blue
< font face = "arial">Arial< /font> you...Arial
< font size = "+2">Larger< /font> you...Larger
< font color = "red" face = "arial">Arial in red< /font> you...Arial in red

I hope this isn't too "tech-y".....


good to know 1
clipped on: 01.24.2008 at 10:30 pm    last updated on: 01.24.2008 at 10:30 pm

RE: DIY copper countertop (Follow-Up #23)

posted by: aliceinwonderland_id on 09.20.2006 at 01:37 pm in Metalworking Forum

Okay, here's a pic of my copper island. It's fitting that I post it here first, since this thread was the one that got me started thinking about a copper island in the new kitchen. Please ignore the shiny brown switch plate just under the countertop - it's hideous and temporary.

Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting


states, more costly then stone!
clipped on: 01.16.2008 at 09:37 am    last updated on: 01.16.2008 at 09:38 am

RE: Prices of your countertops--all countertops (Follow-Up #8)

posted by: fightingoverfinishes on 11.02.2007 at 08:08 am in Kitchens Forum

These are all quotes I have gotten in the last month. I live in the Atlanta area. I have seen promos from a few big fabricators on a few granite colors starting at 37 or 39 a sf. Ususally they have 3 or 4 colors for this price. Also my fabricator has about 12-15 colors of granite that range from 40-59 a sf.

Beleza Soapstone fabricated including tax 113.94
Honed Cambiran Black Granite inc tax 83.65
Cambrian Black Antiqued inc tax 91.00
Absolute balck granite honed inc tax 69.00
Tebas Black Silestone leather inc tax 81.00
Ice Flower or other soapstone not-inc tax 89-
Edges other than eased 12-30 per lf


clipped on: 01.13.2008 at 10:57 am    last updated on: 01.13.2008 at 10:57 am

RE: Show off time! Pics of your rectangular islands (Follow-Up #5)

posted by: tonilynne on 01.12.2008 at 10:19 am in Kitchens Forum

We have a long rectangular island. No appliances, but we do have an awesome base pantry in the island, along with pull out drawers for the tupperware and a big drawer for the big kitchen implements.

Kitchen island

Screened porch is off the kitchen

Base pantry in island, complete with kids' dirty handprints!


nice storage option
clipped on: 01.13.2008 at 10:41 am    last updated on: 01.13.2008 at 10:42 am

RE: Question about depth of cabinet to house CD KA refrigerator (Follow-Up #8)

posted by: lisa_sandiego on 01.05.2008 at 12:35 pm in Kitchens Forum

We went with the KA Counter-depth, but went 42" wide to make up for the loss of cu. ft. However, it becomes a true built-in with a huge jump in price.
But I have some tips for you since you're designing the cabinets. We have the power source in one of the cabinets. Also, the icemaker connection is in another cabinet. And last but not least, my one regret is getting the french doors with the freezer on the bottom. I miss all the freezer shelves that were in my side by side.


great measurement information
clipped on: 01.06.2008 at 05:57 pm    last updated on: 01.06.2008 at 05:58 pm

RE: Unable to view Photobucket (Follow-Up #10)

posted by: starpooh on 12.28.2007 at 06:06 pm in Kitchens Forum

I love photobucket; it's directory-oriented so it's very easy to find an entire album from just one photo.

1. Go back to patty_cakes' thread Full Granite Backsplash vs. something else.
2. Find athomewith3's post.
3. Right click on the link "Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket". Select Copy Image Location.
4. Paste it into your browser. You should see this:
As buehl and sue_ct mentioned the photo PICT0016.jpg was somehow removed from athomewith3's album. But you can still see the rest of her album.
5. Remove the "PICT0016.jpg" from the end of the URL and hit enter. This leaves you with:
This shows you all the photos that athomewith3 has in her photo album.
You can do this "trick" with any photobucket image.

fwiw... athomewith3 DID have other photos in her album. I used one in her FKB post. Perhaps the backsplash photo she was referring to was the one that is now in the FKB:

And sue_ct: buehl has kindly volunteered to follow-up with all the broken photo links in the FKB. Thank you buehl!


clipped on: 12.28.2007 at 06:51 pm    last updated on: 12.28.2007 at 06:51 pm

RE: Help with layout please!! (Follow-Up #4)

posted by: buehl on 12.16.2007 at 07:05 am in Kitchens Forum

Mum: This is what I think the measurements are:

Wall #1: 168"
Wall #2: 132" + ?? doorway + 27" = 157" + ??
Wall #3: 132"
Wall #5: 60" (small island)
.....42"? b/w island and Wall #1?
.....42"? b/w island and Wall #2?
.....42"? b/w island and Wall #3?
Wall #6: 96" (large island)
.....??" b/w large island and small island
.....??" b/w island and Wall #1 (diagonal measurement to end of wall #1's cabinet run)
.....??" b/w island and Wall #3 (diagonal measurement to end of wall #3's cabinet run
Window: 79" + molding?
.....60"? b/w left wall and window
.....30"? b/w right wall and window

Please correct me where I am wrong.

Just curious, what happened to Wall #4?

Is there a reason there are so many "gaps" b/w cabinets and walls? E.g., Wall #2, right side, there are 12" b/w the end of the upper cabinet run & the wall; or, Wall #1, right side, there are 4.5" b/w the end of the base cabinet run and the wall (there are other gaps as well)

This is what I think your appliance wish list is:
36" Refrigerator, counter depth
36" Cooktop
36" Vent Hood...should be 42" (it's strongly recommended the hood be 6" wider than the cooktop)
??" MW
27" single wall oven (b/c you only have a 30" cabinet...a 30" oven will barely fit in a 30" cabinet, if it fits at all; if you want a 30" wall oven, should have a 33" oven/tall cabinet)
36" sink
24" DW
24" Beverage Chiller/Cooler on large island the cabinets & refrigerator/cooler face the FR or Kitchen? It's so far from the main Kitchen that I think it should face the FR. Have you thought of putting a second MW there as well? (for popcorn & other snacks)

I assume you plan to put the table b/w the small and large island...correct?

Once I know the correct measurements, I can work on layouts...


clipped on: 12.25.2007 at 06:50 pm    last updated on: 12.25.2007 at 06:50 pm

What keeps soapstone darker longer. . .The answer! ! !

posted by: florida_joshua on 10.24.2007 at 04:47 pm in Kitchens Forum

So I did a little test to answer the question.

The products:

Clapham's Beeswax Salad Bowl Finish
Bee's Oil
Regular Mineral Oil
Mystery Oil

First a brief discription (my opinion)

Clapham's: It is a paste, inbetween a wax and a liquid. Goes on easy and feels amazing after you put it on. On the touch catagory it is the best of the bunch.

Bee's Oil: It is a wax. A little harder to get on but if you heat it up it would be easier. Has stay power. This is at the top when it comes to keeping the patina on the stone.

Regular Mineral Oil: Needs no discription. It's easy to apply. Would keep a bottle around for those lazy days. Feels oily compared to the wax or paste. That feel goes away quickly though (whithin a hour or two if you wipe it down with a rag).

Mystery Oil: It is a liquid similar to the mineral oil. Not so crazy about the warning lable. Feels a little bit more oily than the mineral oil at first. Seems to react similar to the mineral oil. In my opinion I would rather use the mineral oil just because of convienience considering the warning about it being combustable.

The proof:

This is unoiled stone.
Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket

This is the stone just after application
Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket

This is a picture of the sheen each gives off
Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket

A day after the first oiling
Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket

I then oiled it twice more over the next 2 days and waited 4 days to see what we had. Here it is.
Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket

The mystery oil evaporated the quickest, then the mineral oil, contiuing on to the clapham's, and finally the Bee's oil.

I could continue the process but I do believe that you will continue to see the same results. Over time I think you wouold spend less time applying with the wax products but I would keep the mineral oil around for quick touchups or lazy days.

This test also gives people a good idea of how soapstone will react when it is installed in their home. This process of oiling and or waxing lessens with time. Each variety of soapstone can react differently as well. This means some stone evaporates the oil or wax products off quicker and or slower. Some people leave it unoiled some oil it often. Some like it inbetween and only oil it sometimes. . . So it really is up to the owner to choose how the stone fits your lifestyle. I still have not figured out how describe to someone who does not know about soapstone in one or two paragraphs. I know it sounds cheesy but I feel it's an experience. If you don't touch it, feel it, live with it, you'll never really understand it.


clipped on: 12.25.2007 at 07:49 am    last updated on: 12.25.2007 at 07:49 am

frenchkitty's finished kitchen

posted by: frenchkitty on 11.29.2006 at 06:09 pm in Kitchens Forum

Hi All! I have had a busy couple of years trying to build a house and live through hurricane Katrina at the same time. I have been a lurker for a long time but life has finally calmed down enough, and I became a member recently. I have had several people asking to see my whole kitchen, so here it goes....there was a LOT of blood sweat and tears from DH and myself and our 2 kids. I know you all can relate to that! We did almost everything ourselves that we could do including paint, flooring, trim, etc. Still need to finish that darned curtain for that big expanse of windows to match the other one! Hope you like it!
Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting
Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting
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Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting
Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting
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Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting
Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting
Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting
Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting
Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting
Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting


great soft color and great floor plan
clipped on: 12.19.2007 at 10:41 am    last updated on: 12.19.2007 at 10:41 am

RE: Butcher block island top -- Advice needed!!! (Follow-Up #15)

posted by: ellene613 on 11.14.2007 at 02:53 pm in Kitchens Forum

Soigne, I did a quick search on your checking/splitting wood probem and found this advice:

As the seasons change the humidity level in you home will change. This some times causes wood products to change as well. Small splits in the end grain can occur. Most of the time this is only a cosmetic condition and needs no attention. But if you want to fill the splits we recommend the use of a good wood filler or white glue and saw dust mixed to a thick paste. After filling the split let the filler dry, sand off any excess and refinish.

Melt a 1 to 4 mixture of paraffin and mineral oil and fill all checks. Make sure paraffin seals the check thoroughly. Continue oiling .Epoxy will also work well.

and from
Almost all problems on solid wood countertops, island tops, and butcher blocks are due to dryness. Your butcher block will look great and last for many years if properly treated with mineral oil on a regular basis...

End checks or splits: (separation of the joints along the end of the top or block). This situation is caused by excessive dryness or because the top is not oiled frequently enough. To repair this, melt a 1 to 4 mixture of paraffin and mineral oil and fill all checks or splits. Make sure that paraffin mixture seals any split thoroughly. Continue oiling the top on a regular basis.

To date, we have not had any problems with our maple butcher block island, which was made by AWP Butcher Block. We also did not have any checking or warping with our previous butcher block work table, which we used and cut on for 25 years.


butcher block care ideas
clipped on: 12.19.2007 at 09:09 am    last updated on: 12.19.2007 at 09:10 am

RE: Anybody have geothermal heat/AC? (Follow-Up #2)

posted by: Hairy_old_man on 07.27.2005 at 04:49 pm in Old House Forum

I don't know if anyone is hanging around this thread, its been a while since the last post, but I thought I would write anyway since I'm bored right now and this is an interesting subject. GinaM, just like with solar heating systems, there are two types of geothermal (GT) systems "passive" and "active." When talking about the temperature in her basement being cooler in the summer and warmer in the winter, Gina_in_Fl is obviously referring to simple passive GT. In the summer when air temperatures are high, the walls of her basement, being built into the 55 degree soil, absorbs the heat and transfers it to the cooler ground, thereby cooling the basement. In the winter, the system works the other way, and the walls maintain a temperature near 55 degrees which helps warm the basement air.

I have an active system in my house, utilizing a heat pump that is assisted by a GT "loop." The system involves two "well" holes drilled down to access the water table (25 feet at my place). The water does not need to be "good" potable water because you are not going to actually use the water, all you are interested in is the GT heat held by the water. The drillers (using very fancy drilling equipment) then ran a shaft horizontally between the two vertical shafts to connect them. The vertical well shafts are about 20 feet apart. A series of coiled tubing was installed in the horizontal shaft and lays in the groundwater, which at my location is a constant 54 degrees. The system pumps water (isolated from the groundwater) down one side of the GT coil and back up the other side to the heat pump heat-exchanger. In the winter, it pulls heat out of that 54 degree water to warm the air that it blows into my house. In the summer, it pumps heat from the air in my house, transferring it into the 54 degree water which is then pumped back into the ground.

Gina_in_FL stated, "it would not be a substitute for your main heat system" but in fact the GT system is the only "real" heating system, and the only cooling system I have and it maintains a comfortable temperature year-round in my well insulated, 2,100 square foot one-story with basement house, year-round. We do have a fireplace, but we use it infrequently (I think 8-10 times last winter) and only for ambience on a cold winter night, never for the heat. Being in Ohio, such a system would work well for you, because your temperatures cannot be more extreme than ours here in Nebraska. Our summer temps are usually in the 90s (last Saturday and Sunday it was 104) and winters with periods of very cold temps as low as 10-below are not uncommon.

The system installation for what I have was rather expensive I suppose, about $9,000 in all (in 1998) but some of it was tax deductible under the "renewable energy" provisions, and my heating bills in the coldest winter months average around $110 and cooling costs for July August are typically around $135. The highest winter bill in the last 7 years since installation was $132 the month my mother-in-law was staying with us and she kept the thermostat set at 80 (That month I spent a lot of time in my workshop out or the "heat"... and away from the too-warm house temps). These costs are far below what my neighbors are complaining about paying for their conventional H/C systems. As energy costs continue to rise, my realtive savings will likely increase.

As Gina_in_FL suggested, there have been attempts to simply use tubes buried in the ground, through which air is blown to cool or warm a house. Some people call these "semi-active" systems because there is some mechanical (active) means of moving air through the system, but the cooling of the air is simply conduction, like in a fully passive system. I have known a number of people who attempted this method without success. One trial I am familiar with (in Arkansas) used more than 1,000 feet of 6-inch thin-wall PVC pipe buried 4 feet below the surface. The pipe was divided into 4 loops, so air from the house was blown through roughly 250 feet of pipe and returned to the house. However, it was found that the volume of air needed to affect the temperature of the house is too high, and the amount of heat transferred into the ground from the air blown through the tubes is too low to be of much use. An added problem was condensation in the piping. As the warm-moist air moved through the pipes and gave off what heat it did, it also left moisture behind. The moisture in the pipes then became stale (not to mention the mold and other allergens) and the air coming out of the pipes became very unpleasant (much like a basement that never gets fresh air).


Geo thermal information
clipped on: 12.16.2007 at 05:39 pm    last updated on: 12.16.2007 at 05:40 pm

My finished kitchen.

posted by: sharb on 05.07.2007 at 10:42 pm in Kitchens Forum

I'm sorry it has taken so long for me to post photos of my kitchen. Life has been busy. I just had the house tented for termites this week. My husband is still climbing Mt. Everest and I've been helping babysit for grandchildren. But, I'm loving my kitchen. I don't know if I would go through everything again, but it's over and I love it. If I could do over, there are definitely things I would do differently, but I'm sure no matter how many times I did it, there would be things to improve on.

I want to thank all of you for answering questions that I had. This has been such a great place to share ideas. During a kitchen remodel there is no one else who is as interested as another person doing their own remodel. Thanks. Sharb

Cabinets, perimeter: Premier Custom-Built, Inc. Maple, Beaded inset-1", Door Style-Cambridge 1", Drawer Head style -Cambridge 1", Finish Name: White/GR, Finish family: Cloister
Cabinets, island: Premier Custom-Built, Inc., Wood species: cherry, Door: Beaded inset - 1", Door style-English Cambridge-1", Drawer Head Style: English Cambridge-1", Double pegs on all four corners, Finish Name: Ant. Honey/RU/WM, Finish Family: Colonial Rustic
Knobs and hinges: Gerber ORB
Counter (perimeter): Kashmir Gold Granite
Counter (island): Caesarstone honed Jerusalem Sand
Backsplash: Jerusalem gold
Range: Viking VGSC486-6G Burgundy 48" All Gas with six open burners, 12" wide griddle/simmer plate, double oven, self cleaning, Brass trim, Stainless Steel high shelf,
Range Hood: Burgundy Viking with brass trim.
Refrigerator: 48" Sub-Zero with Top Knobs handles
Sink: Herbeau Fireclay Farm House Sink - White
Faucet, main: Herbeau "Royale" 2 Hole Kitchen Mixer with Wooden Handspray - Finish Weathered Brass
Faucet, Prep Sink: 18" Bates & Bates, Copper, round, hammered
Faucet, prep sink: Herbeau "De Dion" Single Lever Mixer with Wooden Disc Cartridge and Handspray - Finish Weathered Brass
Soap & Lotion Dispenser: Herbeau Weathered Brass
Water Dispenser: Herbeau Weathered Brass
Dishwasher: Miele
Fireplace: Honed Calcutta Marble, custom
Microwave/Convection: Viking
Counter Stools: Ethan Allen
Beverage refrigerator: Viking
Wine refrigerator: Viking
Paint: Benjamin Moore-Rich Cream
Trim paint: BM Custom
Chandeliers: Custom, Uni Lite, Anaheim, CA
Windows: Marvin
Floors: 5" & 7" hand hewn hickory/pecan planks, med-dark finish
Powder Room:
Cabinets: Premier Custom-Built Inc., German glass, milk paint
Hinges and Knobs: Gerber
Faucet: Herbeau with weathered brass finish.
Counter top: Jerusalem Gold
Flooring: King Gold with Calcutta marble keys
Chandelier: Fredrik Ramond
Sink: Kohler

Here is a link that might be useful: Kitchen Photos


nice kitchen, large island, great open floor plan
clipped on: 12.11.2007 at 03:58 pm    last updated on: 12.11.2007 at 03:59 pm

RE: There's an old woman living in my house.... (Follow-Up #10)

posted by: ronf on 12.06.2007 at 04:10 pm in Kitchen Table Forum

You guys are sooo funny.
Speaking of old ladies DW and I just took my 97 year old great aunt shopping this morning. She needed new dress shoes for church and snow boots. She lives out in the country by herself a half mile from us. Still drives to town most days and cuts her own grass in the sumer. She found her shoes and boots and was so tickled when the salesperson asked to see her drivers license after writing out a check. She just had a birthday in Oct. and had to get her license renewed, it's good for another 4 years. She's so proud to still have her license.
She was pretty upset this morning. The snowplow clipped her mailbox and bent it so the door doesn't close right. She spent a good ten minutes cussin' him out. ;-) She doesn't hear very well anymore but her mind is as sharp as a tack. Geez, I hope I can grow old like her.


we should all be this fortunate!
clipped on: 12.08.2007 at 09:28 pm    last updated on: 12.08.2007 at 09:30 pm

RE: Pretty much finished kitchen... (Follow-Up #10)

posted by: coleen3201118 on 10.24.2007 at 05:35 pm in Kitchens Forum

Thanks for the nice comments, everyone! I'm glad there are votes for no window treatments, because that was my initial reaction. You can, however, watch TV from our back yard!

Here's the details:

Cabinets: Omega/Dynasty - Williamsburg - Oyster Maple and Brookside Square cherry Nutmeg antiqued
Counters: soapstone and honed carrara marble
Range: 48" Capital with griddle
Hood - VentaHood
Refrigerator - Thermador built in 42"
Microwave - Sharp 30" drawer
Sink: Franke pro (prep sink is Elkay); Ladylux plus faucets
Backsplash - Sonoma tile

I think that's everything. So far I'm really happy with all the appliances. Knock on wood!


details of coleen's kitchen. Love the soapstone and marble combo and sink, heck I love all of it!!
clipped on: 12.08.2007 at 12:44 pm    last updated on: 12.08.2007 at 12:45 pm

RE: Island pendant heights (Follow-Up #13)

posted by: alku05 on 10.04.2007 at 11:13 am in Kitchens Forum

Jennymama, with an island that wide, you may want to consider doing both can lights and pendant lights to make sure you have enough light there. Our island is 7 x 5 all one level and we put cans over the working side of the island and pendants over the eating side. Once your island gets over 3" wide, it's hard to light it with just one row of lighting down it's center.

Here's a shot of our island's lighting (the center thing in the ceiling is a speaker):

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white granite instead of marble for our island?
clipped on: 12.04.2007 at 12:22 am    last updated on: 12.04.2007 at 12:22 am

RE: Where to buy furniture style island for kitchen??? (Follow-Up #1)

posted by: holligator on 12.02.2007 at 03:44 pm in Kitchens Forum


clipped on: 12.03.2007 at 05:27 am    last updated on: 12.03.2007 at 05:28 am

RE: 8ft kitch ceiling, what type of light over island? (Follow-Up #7)

posted by: kas81057 on 11.02.2007 at 07:07 am in Kitchens Forum

Just wanted to pass along some advice from a lighting guy who has studied art and uses that to work with people. His philosophy, and i stress his, is that if you want artwork (as in beautiful pendants, chandeliers, etc.) buy it and display it, don't use lights as art. He recommends canned, low voltage directed at the features of your kitchen, ie. granite countertops or in our case highlighting a stone fireplace. I had my heart set on pendants but after spending time with him decided to go with him. Nothing is in place yet so i am not sure if this will really be what i wanted, but am hopeful. He utilizes different degreed lights (ie. 15 degrees would brightly light a small area, whereas 40 degrees would light a larger area and not be as intensely lit) to do the highlighting. So over our bar counter we have (4) 15 degree lights shining down, whereas at the sink counter adjacent to the bar we will have (2) with 30 deg radius. One good example is we will have 3 lights over the dining room table, the middle light will be a 15 degree to highlight my "art" centerpiece and the two on either side will be 30's to illuminate the table for dining. Those will be on the same dimmer switch and the middle by itself so they can be dimmed for more of a flush look if we want. His example of the dining area was imagine that the center light was on by itself just illuminating that beautiful centerpiece in the evening. It is a different way of looking at it for sure and like i said, not sure if i will be 100% happy with it but my dh really wanted just the small canned lights and then the electricians explanation of using the different degrees along with dimming totally sold him and since i have picked out everything else i decided i needed to go this route. One thing that also helped me is that the stone fireplace was the basis of color selection and highlighting that was a definite plus for me, i would have never thought to do it, but then again i didn't take a bunch of art classes. Just thought I'd chime in with his advice. I'll let you know the end result.


interesting idea on lighting
clipped on: 11.29.2007 at 05:43 am    last updated on: 11.29.2007 at 05:44 am

RE: Pretty much finished kitchen... (Follow-Up #1)

posted by: rmlanza on 10.24.2007 at 03:18 pm in Kitchens Forum

Wow, really beautiful! Can you give us the details? And FWIW, unless it's a privacy issue, I wouldn't add window treatments...I love the openess of those big windows! I'll post your clicky link.

Here is a link that might be useful: coleens GORGEOUS new kitchen!


coleens kitchen link
clipped on: 11.28.2007 at 09:37 pm    last updated on: 11.28.2007 at 09:38 pm

RE: Soapstone-needs a coordinating countertop for (Follow-Up #10)

posted by: coleen3201118 on 11.05.2007 at 09:18 am in Kitchens Forum

I have soapstone on my perimeter counters and honed carrara on my island. I would have gone all soapstone but we couldn't find a single slab big enough, so we went with carrara and we're very happy we did.
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My favorite kitchen to date!
clipped on: 11.28.2007 at 09:35 pm    last updated on: 11.28.2007 at 09:35 pm

RE: Banquette anyone? (Follow-Up #63)

posted by: needanap on 11.17.2007 at 09:37 pm in Kitchens Forum

I finally got around to taking pictures of ours. It was finished after the kitchen was done, and took forever for the table and chairs to arrive, but now I can share pics. It is not IN the kitchen, but in the adjacent family room, and this is where we eat most of our meals. The kids like sitting on the cushions and fight for who gets that side of the table.
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Here it is in context of the rest of the room, with our newly re-tiled fireplace. I just posted pictures of that in another thread about copper slate tiles.
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Here is a link that might be useful: thread about copper slate backsplash


love the banquette
clipped on: 11.17.2007 at 10:48 pm    last updated on: 11.27.2007 at 11:36 pm

What do you think of this floor plan?

posted by: cqxiao on 07.09.2007 at 11:10 am in Building a Home Forum


We are planning to build a new house and hope we can get some comments and suggestions for our floor plan. (The house is about 3160 square feet total).

First Floor

Second floor

Thanks a lot


jack and jill bath on the second floor
clipped on: 11.11.2007 at 10:35 pm    last updated on: 11.11.2007 at 10:36 pm

1st gas bill since tankless waterheater install

posted by: trailrunner on 09.03.2006 at 02:25 pm in Appliances Forum

We got a Noritz 6.4gpm gas exterior mounted. Our bill was $9.00 less this first full month after install. We are really pleased. The hot water at 108 degree setting is perfect for showers also whites are still coming out very white in the wash. The farthest bathroom takes 45 sec for hot water to get to it. So we are very pleased. Our water use bill dropped $3.00 so we are not running more cold while waiting for hot. All in all we are very pleased. Just thought there might be some of you who would like to see this data. Caroline


clipped on: 09.03.2006 at 10:56 pm    last updated on: 09.03.2006 at 10:56 pm

certifiable ths tko finished kitchen (long)

posted by: thull on 08.03.2006 at 04:07 pm in Kitchens Forum

We finally finished up our remodel to the point where we could move back in a few weeks ago. Have a lot of projects still to be done around the house, but the kitchen and master bath are done enough to show.

I'm going to try to insert pix as I go, so I apologize to anyone on a slow connection. And the photos aren't the greatest in terms of lighting. Taking them at night and keeping a good exposure balance wasn't easy.

The particulars:

Cabinets: Scherr's, doors are shaker with solid center panel in select cherry
Knobs/pulls: Knob Hill "martini" knob (HD only) and Liberty "retro curl" pull (
Range: Bluestar 36" RNB, six burners
Hood: Vent-a-hood SEPXH18-242
Granite: Verde Butterfly, 3cm
Wall paint: BM, color is 1301, I forget the name of the red
Dishwasher: Kitchenaid KUDS02FRSS
Sink: Rohl Allia 6337 undermount
Faucet: Brizo Venuto in stainless w/ soap dispenser
Disposal: Insinkerator 444 w/ air switch
Fridge: Kitchenaid KSCS25INSS
Convection/Micro: GE JE1590
Pendants: forget brand- low voltage amber pyramid pendants from HD
Backsplash: 1x1 slate mosaic w/ "antique grey" outlet covers from Vermont Slate Art
UC Lights: GE Profile fluorescent
Floor: 3/4" oak strip, mixed new and c. '49; Minwax "Golden Oak" stain, Bona Traffic finish

OK, here's the overview. We haven't found counter stools yet, but there's a 12" overhang in the front of the island. It's supported by 3/8" steel bars, and the two center panels are actually doors to a cabinet. The island is roughly 5' x 8'.

Basically, before the project, this was two rooms, with a wall that lined up where the middle of the hood/range is. Left was the dining room, and the kitchen to the right.

Here's the view to one side of the island. Left of the door is the bar (where the plastic lock is on the door). The wall cabs are 13" deep.

The glass-front cabinets house our "company" dishes and various glassware. The 36" wide drawer bases below have everyday dishes, nice flatware, and various trays/bowls/baking dishes.

Here's a couple of closer views of the island and wall w/ the range. To the left of the range is a cabinet w/ tray dividers and a 4-drawer stack. Pot and pan drawers (30", 2-drawer stack) are to the right of the range)

Here's the wall w/ pantry cabs, more drawers, the fridge and MW. The big cab to the L of the fridge has pullout trays. We have another pantry in the laundry room (outside the french door in the other photos), and we haven't worked out what to put in each yet. Drawers to the L of fridge have everyday flatware, punkin gear, and overflow pots/pans. Drawers under microwave have bags/wraps, plastic ware, and colanders/mixing bowls. Above the MW are everyday glassware and misc stuff.

Closer view of the range:

Bad, but closer view of the backsplash:

Next is the sink/faucet/DW. Left of the sink (not pictured) are two cabs, one w/ a Rev-a-shelf trash pullout, and the other a skinny one for cutting boards w/ knives in a drawer above.

And finally, SWMBA (She Who Must Be Adored) aka "punkin," who finally gets to live in her house. She had just (finally) started walking all by herself, but was still doing it "monster style" because she was used to holding someone's hand(s).

Anyway, I've been reading, learning, and finally contributing at THS for several years leading up to this. So, we're really excited to finally be in the home stretch.


clipped on: 08.28.2006 at 03:59 pm    last updated on: 08.28.2006 at 04:00 pm